UPDATE: Brother Slaying Over a Sports Game

July 18, 2007
Yesterday's GamePolitics story concerning a 13-year-old who stabbed his brother to death over a video game lacked one critical piece of information:
What game was being played?

If the brothers were playing Grand Theft Auto, for example, the game violence backlash would be inevitable. While we still don't know the precise game being played, the Philadelphia Inquirer is now reporting that it was a sports game.

We'll report more details as they become available.
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Comments

So now they'll be saying that Madden NFL is too violent and must be toned down?

Hah.

One of them was probably playing as Pac-Man Jones. The video game connections just never end!!!

suck it jack.

But.. but... but... video... images... children.... bad..

I kind of hope this little tidbit is true. It would be the best case scenario for the game industry. No one can claim the game was mis-rated by the ESRB, or that Kratos told him to do it.

Still, I wonder how the parents are reacting to this..? I hope they make it through this.

@ Papa Midnight

Lol. Yea, that would go over real well. You know, seeing how the video game is based on an actual sport that airs on TV regularly.

@Gameboy

That just means they need to tone down real football to two hand touch. and they must be wearing a suit that would protect them from a grizzly bear attack.

something tells me this kid was bi-polar. its just a real shame that the parents had to find out this way.

How much exp does a lvl 13 get for taking out a lvl 16?




More seriously, I am not surpised it's a sports game. Ultimately it will probably turn out this kid had mental problems or was in a gang or something.

Proof that video games don't make people violent, sports make people violent... Nah just kidding, I don't know what to make of this. I am saddened because someone is still dead, but at the same time this IS a best case scenario because there will be no backlash at the vg industry or the sport in which the game was simulating. People might have to *cue audible gasp* take a step back a accept that little Timmy is actually messed up mentally (weather through fault of the parents or just bad genes) and he's not going to grow up to be a rich doctor or a great philosopher, at best he can hope for a degree in law in Miami, but that's about it...

Honestly it's a good thing and terrible thing in one move. On the good side, this is a case of violence revolved around games that weren't rated m, and weren't necessarily violent enough to warrant such behavior. This will bring into question what other games the boy has played however. If any of them were what could be seen as violent and whatnot.

If he never had contact with games outside of his age level in the rating system, this provides good news towards the, "games do not make you want to kill someone" argument. But the fact that someone had to die to help this along the way is a terrible thing. It's a price that just shouldn't be paid just to prove something one side knows, and the other side refuses to accept.

So while I'm glad that people who often jump on the backs of game developers and lash out at them for making death simulators won't be able to ignore this flaw in their logic system. It sucks plain and simple that someone lost their life to do it.

WiNG, I have to admit I laughed at that. Which I guess makes me evil... ah well.

If it does turn out to be a sports game, I'm sure that part will be conveniently be omitted where necessary to ensure all games remain to be seen as bad.

Once again, Jack Thompson gets his ass handed to him.

@ Godkarmachine O Inary

Its good to see that you feel bad. Um... I don't mean that like it sounds. We all feel bad. The point I'm trying to make is that no video game critic ever seems to feel bad for the victims. They never express condolences towards the statistics they state. In this way, we are far more human than they can imagine.

Oh, I see they are throwing multiple charges at him then they will drop the ones that they can't make stick, well that makes more sense.

Interesting to note that it was bent.

@ Gameboy

True, you have a point there, it seems like whenever someone dies as a "result" of video game violence. You don't even hear about the person who died, just the evils of the game company, and how the poor killer was mentally abused and twisted by a sick game.

The game critics forget someone died, and move on to using a death as nothing more than ammo against games.

Hang on, we're not out of the forest yet. It could be Wii Sports, and the Wii is the current nuclear whipping boy of the new console generation.

I know when JT comes along and tries to use something like this as a platform for his zealotry we all call him on it and tell him what a schmuck he is for doing so. Tho I wonder if we are just as bad when we cheer for the evidence being the opposite? It seems as if we're using the same tragedy to promote our stance as he is.

Something to ponder.

So this was likely over a game of Madden, a video game that depicts a sport for some to be sacred?

I hate football, but I never hated it that much.

Ugh, you know the fact it was a sports game will be glossed over by most media. The first report just stated video games were involved in a fight that lead to a murder. Do you think most of the media outlets are going to give a follow-up report stating it was a sports game? Do you think people like Jack Thompson won't still use this as an example? He tends to speak to people who are ignorant when it comes to gaming culture, so when he makes a vague statement saying video games caused a murder no one in the crowd will ask "What type of game was it?". No, when most non-gamers hear the phrase "video games" they think of simulated violence. They don't think of Civilization or Katamari Damacy, they think of Doom and GTA.

@Citizen_snips

Bipolar? How would being bipolar have anything to do with obvious anger management issues?

@jdecamp

That's an interesting point, but in our case I think the feeling is closer to "relief" than "celebration" which makes all the difference. Thompson is in the business of hoping people are killed in incidents where video games can be associated. Though we may have our own selfish motives, we're conversely disappointed and angered when such an association is made. And truly, there is nothing positive to take out of what happened here. A person is dead which is the worst part, and more selfishly, sports game or not, other games in the home are still going to be evaluated and the news can only get worse from here.

Ideally we shouldn't have to sit here and talk about our own freedom being threatened when an unrelated tragedy occurs, but that's the time we live in right now and I accept that part of the culture for what it is.

@Miraba: violent behavior during manic phase is fairly common in bi polar people.

There have been murders over sports for thousands of years.

I knew them sports games were evil :P

A sports game? Maybe it was soccer riot '07.

The problem is, the actual game they were playing at the moment won't phase the anti-game enthusiasts. If they had a single violent game in their collection, they will blame this violence on that. I can't think of any shooters that were playing a video game AT THE MOMENT that they fired the gun, and they had no moral problem trying to pin those events on video games.

@Mirababe

cause i know people who are bi-polar, and a situation like this occurred with one of them, only it didn't lead to someones death and it wasn't over a video game, but did involve a knife.

sorry for double post, but when someones first reaction to a situation is to grab a knife and start stabbing with the intent to kill, it displays something far more than an anger management issue.

No, the issue is whether they played any of the violent games at any time, given the proven extended effects of such violent game play.

Dear Carbonatedgravy:

We're supposed to take seriously someone who uses that name?

Secondly, I'm in the business of trying to save lives lost at the hands of future minor gamers who are sold mature violent games. I get it. Doctors who treat lung cancer are actually thrilled when someone comes to them with the disease right? How pathetic, how self-righteously deluded you are.

Jack Thompson calls someone self righteously deluded.

Says it all really.

@John Bruce "Massacre-chaser" Thompson


What proven extended effects? Your masturbation fantasies do not count. You may be able to fool soccer moms with a ten second sound bite on CNN and not have to back it up, but once again, don't expect us to buy into that shit. Back up what you say or don't bother to comment at all. No one here is buying what you are selling.

This is great news! Well, provided that the sports game in question wasn't Blitz: The League...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blitz_The_League#.22Campaign_Mode.22

@ Mr. John Bruce Thompson,
Then why don't you go out and inform the parents to not purchase such entertainment for their children?

Jackie, Jackie, hush and sit down. We don't need your controversy.

@Jack Thompson

I'm not going to argue over whether violent video games have an effect on minors. That's a debate best settled by experts in child psychology. And I also am not going to argue that all aspects of this incident should be thoroughly investigated, including video games if need be. The only thing I object to is jumping to the conclusion that ALL youth violence is a result of violent video game play. It would be ludicrous to argue that ALL youth violence is a result of video game play since we've had violent young people as long as we've had violent adults.

Let us all not make assumptions as to what the cause of this incident may or may not be.

wow, JT dismisses someones argument because of the name they use. *rolls eyes*

@Ace of Stevens and Citizen_Snips

Or it could be indicative of a different other mental disorder with the symptom of poor control of violent impulses. It could be depression, stress, hormones. It could be genetic or induced by something he was taking. You can diagnose a disorder from a handful of news stories?

The best can be done right now is to rule out what didn't cause it. Was the knife in the kitchen or near the tv? Did he feel threatened (rationally or irrationally) or was he just pissed off because he lost?

@ Miraba
so then it could be a hand full of mental illnesses, I was pointing out that the actions taken by this child was very extreme, therefor pointing to some type of metal illness. I based it off of my own experiences. I am not claiming to be an expert on Bi-polar disease, nor am i trying to make a connection between said disease and stabbings.

@Citizen_Snips

We don't even know if the intent was to kill. The chest is the biggest target and it may have been a matter of whichever body part was easiest to hurt.

Is there any better coverage out right now?

@Jack Thompson

"Secondly, I’m in the business of trying to save lives lost at the hands of future minor gamers who are sold mature violent games."

The help the ESRB inform parents about what games their kids shouldn't be playing.

Exactly Miraba, anyone who thinks this biols down to a single influence or cause or inspiration is living in lala land, you could just as easily blame the Biblical story of Cain and Abel as his 'inspiration'.

The important part now is not deciding whether the Government should raise our children for us, or whether the Game Industry should be descriminated against because of the delusional fantasies of one laughable practitioner of law, it's finding why, every once in a while, this happens, and has happened over hundreds of years. To say a 13-year old wouldn't normally kill is only accurate for the last few hundred years, and only in Western countries for the main part. A 13-year old boy in Ancient Greece was considered a man and expected to fight in a war. Since that point, society has focussed on trying to remove that aggressive urge, but it can never be done completely, it's part of who we are, it's the prime method for survival.

Take a look at Thompson and how he wants to 'destroy' Rockstar, he doesn't just want to get them to tone down their games he wants to destroy them. How is that any less a violent impulse? Thompson is an incredibly violent person, and will always be so. Violence takes lots of different forms and is as old as humanity itself. It's that which we are up against, not some kind of digital bogeyman.

@ Miraba

..... because everyones first thought when they are angry is to pick up a knife and start stabbing the first thing they see....

you can't possibly be serious. No one thinks .o0O(hey, I'm gonna stab someone, but I don't want to kill them, just teach them a lesson. Yeah, thats the ticket!)

This isn't surprising at all. Sports fans are notorious for the level of violence they engage in when it comes to sports rivalries.

Yeah, I'm stereotyping, but come on, how many gamers do you know tip cars, trash stores, and riot through the night because they lost/won?
-- If your wiimote goes snicker-snack, check your wrist-strap...

Jack, did you crap your pants or is your mouth actually your rectum?

Are you kidding me? In a perfect world you'd use the same percentage of your brain as the average individual. Too bad the world will never be close to perfect.

Jabrwock, yea your partially right but you are doing the same thing that JT is doing. I'm a avid sports fan, I don't miss a week of NFL football. I've never tipped over cars because my favorite team lost. I've never known anyone that tipped over a car because my team lost. I've never known anyone that got into a fight because their favorite team lost. I dunno sounds like your taking the hypocritical stance.

@Citizen_Snips

He probably does have some sort of mental imbalance, but I doubt it can be diagnosed through a news story.

You *have* had violent outbursts, yes? I've thrown a game controller at my brother's head (cause: killing me too many times in Goldeneye), punched someone across a kitchen table in the jaw (cause: making lewd jokes in my direction all evening), and taken a swing at my boyfriend (cause: he bit a hole in my t-shirt). Three shots to the head, and it was never "Oh, I'm going to kill you." It was always "I've told you to stop, you haven't stopped, and you still aren't stopping, so I'm going to hurt you until you do." I can easily imagine grabbing something nearby if I paused for a second. If I had a knife in my hand, I can imagine still taking a swing.

Am I psychotic? No. Bipolar? No. Clinically depressed? No. I'm what teachers refer to as "overly sensitive."

It doesn't excuse his actions, but I can easily see how it would happen because he wasn't thinking rationally.

Jack you piece of shit. you sicken me.

@ Miraba

My only outbursts were during high school and mostly damaging to myself. I got pissed off I punched a locker until it wouldn't close some other inanimate object. I've only purposely injured other people who physically attacked me first. And I have never, ever injured someone other a video game, just because someone is better than you at a video game or uses cheap tactics to get a win is never a cause for physically harming them. PERIOD. it is just a game and thats all it is ever going to be.

damn proof reading

"...I got pissed off I punched a locker until it wouldn’t close, OR PUNCH some other inanimate object."

"...And I have never, ever injured someone OVER a video game."

@Citizen_Snips

Did I say that my responses were reasonable or rational? I'll be the first to admit that they weren't. However, I happen to be hardwired that way and those are my experiences.

My god. Jack thompson makes a post that isn't insulting. Insipid, juvinile, hoplessly lacking in evidence, and dissenting just for the mere sake of being annoying, but not insulting. Oh, Bravo Jack. You deserve a gold star for your effort. Now go sit down. You need to learn when you've lost. No one in the world is going to assume that video games CAUSED this murder.

On a lighter note, I'm willing to bet this kid forget his meds. Or at the very least NEEDED to be medicated. No one, gamer or not, stabs someone over who's turn it is. There's some other factor in the mix.

@ Miraba

well if thats how you want to rationalized it fine. whatever, it doesn't change the fact that the kid killed his bother because the bother wouldn't give up the controller.

I'm pretty sure that doesn't fly in court, if it does then i have my excuse if I kill someone.

@Citizen_Snips

So, now I said it was a valid excuse? It may be a reason, but it's certainly no excuse.
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