U.K. Conservative Slams Violent Games & other Influences in Wake of Youth Slaying

In the wake of the brutal ride-by slaying of an 11-year-old Liverpool boy on Wednesday, the leader of Great Britain’s Conservative Party has attacked a number of cultural influences – including video games. As reported by the Times, David Cameron said:

What has become of our society when we have this spate of children killing children?”

It means understanding and acting on that age-old maxim that it takes a village to raise a child. It means retailers stopping the sale of alcohol to young teenagers. It means music companies, media companies, games manufacturers, not just thinking, ‘What is my social responsibility as a company in terms of the projects I support and the charities I back, good and important as they are’, but asking, ‘What is the effect of the music I produce, the games I market and the programmes I broadcast?’

Coincidentally, fellow Conservative Jeremy Hunt was interviewed recently by MCV regarding the British game industry. Among his comments:

The UK video games industry is obviously a vitally important part of our economy. The Government needs to do all it can to support the video games sector and allow it to flourish.

I would, however, place equal weight on the cultural influence that games can have. As children and young people make up a significant proportion of video game users it is important for the industry to act in a responsible and sensitive way.

Issues involving content have largely focused on the negative aspects associated with games. The arguments around Resistance: Fall of Man and Manchester Cathedral being the most recent example. The industry needs to accept it has a duty to act responsibly when it comes to appropriate content and politicians and the media needs to realise that the industry can have a positive impact on young people’s lives…

I believe that it is time for the games industry to act in a responsible and sensitive way and play their part in the prevention of unsuitable material falling into the hands of children. It is essential that manufacturers take seriously the messages sent out by violent and increasingly life-like video games and I believe that most currently do so.

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    KenshinSlayer says:

    “Thank God for MP Cameron, as adult leaders on both sides of the pond are understanding that pop culture is by and large raw sewage in which teens are drowning.

    Once you kids grow up, you’ll understand. Until then, pay attention. You’ll learn something. Remember, I was once as ignorant as you. I grew up.”

    First of, you believer “pop culture” nowadays is violent video games? I was under the impression that “pop culture” is volatile and that it changes very quickly. “Pop culture” means popular culture, and from what I see, “pop culture” nowadays is more focused on enviromentalism more than anything else. Heck, look at the Live Earth Concerts. I’m sorry if you believe enviromentalism is “raw sewage.”

    Second of all, you make the assumption that all gamers are kids once again. Games like Bioshock target adults like you Jack. It would be a sad mistake to believe that the game industry is trying to shove mature games down little kids throat. And besides, selling mature games nowadays requires the purchaser to have a driver’s license to prove that you are over 18. Wherever you sent your kid to pick up GTA, I would assume that the retailer was probably an independent business, therefore, you can sue that retailer instead of going after the big companies. And besides, why are you going after Take-Two in particular? Just because of GTA? I’ve seen a lot of violent video games pass under your violence radar. For example, Silent Hill, Resident Evil, God of War, etc. Why just Take-Two?

  3. 0
    KenshinSlayer says:

    Back on topic. Parent’s should be responsible for their children. It takes very little effort to prevent a child from playing an M-rated game. That’s what parenting is about, takeing care of your child. They brough the child into the world, and they have the responsibility to look after thier child.

    Jack Thompson, you yourself are a father, and I hope you understand that it’s your responsibility to police them. The game industry provides entertainment for a wide variety of different audiences, from toddlers to adults, just as the movie industry targets different audiences with different movies. Just as it’s the parents responsibility to prevent children from watching porn or violent movies, it is their responsbility to choose the games appropriate to their children. The game industry even provides an easy way to identify games that are for mature audiences through ESRB and their rating system, which is largely viewed as a reliable rating system.

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    theneonlobster says:

    i was at ebgames downgrading psp’s this weekend, discussing the upcoming release of manhunt 2. the folks at ebgames have a strict policy of not selling rated m games to minors or they could lose their jobs. when parents come in with kids, they try to inform them of better, more kid-friendly games, typically being told that if the mother doesn’t buy it, the father will, or the kid will have a tantrum.

    that’s what’s wrong with kids these days.

    and if this guy wants corporate responsibility, i could list a dozen corporations acting less responsible than the videogame industry.

  5. 0
    gs68 ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    @ KenshinSlayer

    Shouldn’t have bothered. He’s just going to retailate with something along the lines of “oh, you’re a gamer, and by extension a fucking idiot, therefore everything you said is invalid.”

  6. 0
    KenshinSlayer says:

    This is the letter I sent to Jack Thompson. I hope he responds.

    Dear Jack Thompson,

    I hope you realize by stating these words, you have proven that it’s not the ideology that’s important, it’s the financial gain. While it is true that there is corporate responsibility in some cases, it is also true that there are personal responsibilities. It is the personal responsibility of a parent to watch their child, to protect their child, etc. Meaning that if a child buys a violent video game, it should be with a parents approval. It is absurdity to believe that no parent has time to look at the cover of a game to check the ESRB rating of the game to prevent their child from playing M-rated games. Also, I notice you only go after such games as Bioshock and GTA. The problem with this is there are plenty of other games that are even more violent then Bioshock, GTA, and Manhunt, i.e. God of War, Gears of War, Dead Rising, etc. The only link between these games is that they are all published by the parent company Take-Two. Therefore, I believe it is reasonable for myself to believe that you have either a strong grudge against Take-Two, or, because of the recent software success of said company, you wish to extract some sort of financial gain. Also, I notice that when the group known as Penny Arcade has asked for a debate, the first thing you do is to inform other medias. In other words, you immediately begin advertising yourself. Once again, financial gain would be the only reason you would do such act. I, a gamer of 18 years old, believe that you need to get your act together and realize the irony of what you are doing. While you champion your own use of the First Amendment, you strike down others First Amendment Rights. And not just in the game industry. You condemn gamers right to what they think of you, and that is a huge mistake. A gamer is NOT a second class citizen as you seem to state. Anybody can be a gamer, whether they be man or woman, adult or child, tall or short, fat or skinny, rich or poor. Your assumptions that all gamers are “teenagers” shows your view of gamers.
    In conclusion I hope you will respond to this e-mail in kind, as I’ve refrained from name calling. I hope you will do the same if and when you return this e-mail.


    PS: My online identity does not correlate with my ideals. I do not want to Slay all Kenshins. I hope you can understand this, and not use my online identity as another way to aim a smart remark at me.

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    Snakestream ( User Karma: 0 ) says:


    Yes, I understand that profuse swearing may detract from an argument, but sometimes, when I see the same ridiculous junk being thrown out over and over, I just get really pissed off. I’ll admit that my previous post was a little excessive, but I usually try to refrain from excessive swearing when I am making an argument. However, swearing is common English, and if used properly, it can enhance an argument by conveying proper emotion and severity, although I will admit that my above post did not use it to that effect. Still, with so much worse in the world, I don’t personally feel that the world is going to stop just because people swear too much.

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    Kincyr ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    @Jack Thompson
    “Further, everyone on this planet who has power has a responsibility to exercise it for the common good. Heck, even Spiderman gets that.”

    Don’t forget that Spiderman and Batman were once persecuted as videogames are now. Videogames are the new movies, comic books, and rock&roll.

    “Jack Thompson

    PS: Hooah!”

    Way to insult our troops Jack. Also, the name field signs your comment for you so you sound like a redundant kid. Oh, and by calling us kids, you sound like a pedophile.

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    GoodRobotUs ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    BlackIce is certainly right there, there’s basically no chance of the Tories getting the next election, however, when the Tory Party Leader brings up an issue such as Media, the Presiding party has to respond to it in some way. I don’t expect the Labour party, when faced with a popularity play, to be any more accepting or less stereotyping of Video Games than the Tories are, this is about votes, not about facts.

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    BlackIce says:

    Look, people are starting to twig that Mr.Cameron is an idiot anyway. Gordon Brown has the next election in the bag at the mo, so do we really need to worry about what the Tories think?

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    SlyFox says:


    “Once you kids grow up, you’ll understand. Until then, pay attention. You’ll learn something. Remember, I was once as ignorant as you. I grew up.”

    O’ rly? Did you now? Yes, someday, those of us who are not already adults (either mentally or considered so by legal standards) WILL grow up and become adults. However, the difference between us and you will be that we will be the one’s in power, while those who hold/abuse it now will be in retirement homes.

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    HandofCrom ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    @Everyone discussing religion

    Can we stay on topic? This site is about debating video games and their role in politics and society, not about religion. Religion is applicable when in certain cases, like the Church of England being money-grubbing scumbags over Resistance: Fall of Man, or in describing how wicked, corrupt men like JBT want to use religion as an excuse to force their ideas on everyone else. I, personally, have no respect for religion, I think it is bunk, has no rational basis, and is the archenemy of reason and scientific and social progress, but I think we need to stay focused. If we want to discuss religion, let’s find another site or start a specific forum thread. Otherwise, stay limited and focused in comments.

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    Pandralisk says:

    My comments about the Christian deity are all easily supported by scripture: refer to the books of Leviticus, Deut., Revelations for only a few examples. I do not see how the terms “genocidal” and “evil” do not apply to an entity that has purportedly slaughtered millions of humans, commanded the rape and conquest of non-Israeli states, permited eternal torture, and supported the institution of slavery. Again, I pose the question, why are people like Thompson so outraged that a child might have access to a video game FOR ADULTS, when children are exposed to insane superstitious beliefs — which are preached as a literal truth — YEARS before their underdeveloped minds are able to understand, comprehend, and objectively critique the belief systems?

    I would much rather perfer that we leave each other alone but religious biggots will not stop hunting freedom. I think one of the few strategies left open is to objectively critique where their “values” and “morality” come from and illustrate the subjectivity and superstition of their beliefs. Judeo-Christian “morality” serves as the chief modivation for these attacks on media freedom. Considering the fact that such “morality” amounts to little more than bronze-age superstition, I think it is in the best intrest of proponents of gaming rights to attack the head of the beast; instead of swinging wildly at the arms whenever they lundge out in an effort to “save teh children”.

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    Chuma ( User Karma: 0 ) says:


    “Thank God for MP Cameron, as adult leaders on both sides of the pond are understanding that pop culture is by and large raw sewage in which teens are drowning.”

    Of course this is the same MP Cameron who wants to cut red tape in this contry by getting rid of health and safety and maximum working hours with standard pay.

    He is just trying desperately to be a Tory version of Tony Blair, who incidently is a pretty hated figure this side of the Atlantic.

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    Haruspex says:

    Firstly I think this whole nonsense about the UK descending into anarchy, with rambunctious children prowling the streets is blown massively out of proportion. We need to understand that the youth has always been under fire in their respective context, be it Teddy Boys, Hippies, Mods and Rockers et cetera.

    Secondly, and much more importantly, we have to unearth the reasons why the youth of today are so disaffected. How is it that in one of the richest nations on Earth the children are so unhappy? Well firstly is an issue that affects all in society, and that is inequality. If we look at the hard facts we see inequality on the increase- in Britain 12.7 million people live in relative poverty, last year saw the largest annual rise since 1994; the time of a housing market crash. On the Gini index, a scale that measures income inequality (from 0-100), the figure stands at 34.7, when Blair took power in 1997 that was 33; in 1979 it stood at 25. A recent study by the Jospeh Rowntree Foundation shows the gap between rich and poor is the highest in 40 years.

    If we look at the levels of crime as an indicator of a ‘happy’ society we find that during periods of least inequality crime (and alcohol consumption) are at their lowest. Crime fell from an all time high in the Victorian era to a low during the First World War, where it remained steady until around the 1950s when prosperity, and the number of rich, increased.

    The education system also has a major role in shaping our youth, it has always been the case that capitalism requires workers to be educated enough to know their ‘place’ in society and no further. With the current education policy we have a system fixated on targets and grades, one that trains and encourages individuals to assimilate into rat race with the promise of wealth at the end, it is not surprising that many fall short; that is the nature of the system.

    We are constantly bombarded with images of fame and riches, we are suffocated with the latest fashions and consumer durables. The media is to shoulder the blame for this, for hammering home the message that wealth and status is the be all and end all, however me must ask who the media serves and who it is controlled by- it is these same regressive moralists in the vein of Cameron. He espouses the virtues of free enterprise and individualism, he wants business to play a greater part in education, yet, when the product of his values emerges in the form of these horrific murders, he pounces on peripheral matters rather than the root causes of inequality, poverty, alienation and racism.

    Growing up in poverty severely damages your education. If we use an indicator for poverty in school, the number of children on free school meals, we find that three quarters of these have very low achievement at school. Half of those students on free meals who are doing well at primary school fall behind during secondary school. Somehow I don’t think the awful swill served in canteens is toxic enough to cause such figures.

    Growing up in an area of widespread unemployment and deprivation is also an important factor, ‘choice’ policies that concentrate poorer pupils in particular secondary schools are detrimental. The league table system and the focus on five A-C grades also neglects the most disadvantaged, leading schools to concentrate on those just below the A-C level of attainment.

    Housing is another factor that can lead to the alienation and disaffection of the youth. The charity Shelter found that more than one million children live in housing which is overcrowded, run-down, damp or dangerous. Many suffer from chronic insecurity as a result of being shuffled from place to place in ‘temporary’ accommodation. Martin Luther King spoke about the psychological impact of poor housing. I heard about a poetry project involving young people who live in flats, if you are living in squalor amongst cockroaches, rats and damp then you are obviously going to feel worthless. We also have to look at who the victims of this violence are, murder rates have increased in the past 25 years but the richest 20% of society have seen a fall in murder rates. The poorest 10% (by area) have seen a rise of 39%.

    I would like to explore the dastardly claims aimed at the ‘Black community’ in relation to crime, comments by politicians such as Blair are openly racist, but I feel I have said my part already.

    To conclude, poverty, alienation and inequality are all major contributors to the upsurge in youth violence. An education system that has no time for children with emotional difficulties or different ways of expressing their abilities outside of the rigid exam system massively adds to the problem. Young people are left in limbo, without any prospects or sense of self-worth, in 2004 around 750,000 or 5.5 million 16-24 year olds were not in education, employment or training. A whopping 85% of young people in prison have mental health problems.

    It is always the poor that suffer from crime, but it is always the poor that are blamed for crime. Perhaps we should look at the conditions that shape them rather than knee-jerk solutions and more hard-hitting strategies that are doomed to fail.

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    Space_For_Rent ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    @ Jack Thompson,

    I honestly agree with the concept of keeping young children safe from violent videogames. Little Billy certainly doesn’t need to garrote people with his Wii Remote + Nunchuck every day when he gets home from school. But the fact is, no offense, in my opinion you are going about it the wrong way.

    First off, the personal attacks and broad (and often false/unproven) generalizations REALLY do a poor job of getting people to agree with your cause. It just makes you seem ridiculous, and doesn’t help your cause in the slightest.

    Secondly, I think the methodology you are using to try and solve the issue is suboptimal. (My opinion, I am sure almost as many holes if not more could be poked in my point of view by someone who went to the effort)

    Trying to govern media through censorship and government age limits and all that still doesn’t solve one major problem: More often than not, these violent videogames are being bought by the parents, not the minors themselves. (Unproven, but I have never seen anyone aside from people who appear to be either late teens or nonminors purchasing violent videogames without an adult present)

    I think the more effective way to solve this problem would be this: Educating the parents and providing them the appropriate information to choose for their family what is acceptable. After all, who is giving the children the money to buy said violent videogames? Who is driving them to the store? Who sees said videogames sitting on the shelf/being played every time they come home? The parents. They know their children, and it should be there responsibility to decide what is or is not appropriate for their children. BUT, the parents need to KNOW about the content of the games their children own/want to buy, through impartial ratings systems such as the ESRB and PEGI, possibly with government backing (HERE is where your bill-writing expertise could really become useful), so that they can make educated decisions on what is best for their family. And if the child’s parents don’t care enough to do that much, there is FAR more wrong in that household than the fact that minors are playing violent games.


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    BearDogg-X says:

    @ Ivresse

    It’s still a valid point, regardless. If you have to curse to get it across, so be it, especially considering that the opposition ignores common sense and reason.

    You’re being just as bad as Jacky Boy whining over one post out of an average of a hundred posts per news item. And you call me pathetic?

    Ah, well, I’m agreeing to disagree and moving on.

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    Stitched says:

    What is the social responsibility of a country in terms of the wars we support and the hostile coup d’etats we back, good and important as they are.

    I’m paraphrasing but far be it for most normal democracies to dictate what morale compass should be used and followed.

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    Phoenix says:

    Wow…an atheist version of Jack Thompson…

    Way to go Pandralisk, you and Jackie boy both make bad arguments with black and white attitudes, and make each of your religions look bad in the process. Nice job, feces stain.

  20. 0
    Ivresse says:

    @ Beardogg-X

    How pathetic of you to pick holes at common sense. Your quote’s weak because you’re comparing the use of ‘shit’ to constantly adding f**k to every single sentence in front of every single noun, which is what I’m saying is the problem.

    Yes swearing is legitimised to some extent, but there’s still a time and a place for using it, and constantly adding f**k when you’re trying to make a point isn’t one of them, it just makes you look like a child who only just discovered the word and is now using it liberally because it’s cool, not someone who has a valid point to make.

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    tony selby ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    @ Pandralisk

    I generally try to avoid commenting on things such as this but your arguments are so far over the top that it is painful to read

    first off, for the most part the people writing the Anti-video game legislation are on the left side of the political spectrum, while there are some on the right that are forerunners in the fight against violent video games (such as Brownback) most of them seem to be from the left

    secondly religious belief is not a republican exclusive trait, especially when you consider that the majority of the country follows some form of Christianity, or Catholicism

    your comments about the Cristian deity, whether you truly believe that or not, are at best very insensitive, and do not help to bring anything to the cause of protecting the rights of video game players and developers, and if anything hurt the cause as it paints gamers as combative and aggressive at the very least

    please note that these comments are not coming from a religious person, so don’t think I’m trying to just blindly defend a faith that i don’t actually have

  22. 0
    Pandralisk says:

    Ah, typical hypocritical conservative garage. Don’t you love when someone who worships a ficticious, genocidal, bronze-age war god claims to know what is “good” and “just” for children? You think people like Thompson and Cameron would be opposed to forcing children to be indoctrinated in an extremely complicated and violent religious tradition that lacks the most basic forms of evidnece.

    But, of course not, it is all the fault of “teh evil videoz gamez.” What I would give to see a strong leftist establishment crack down on religious practices (for the children, of course) so these Bible-thumping morons might sample a taste of their own medicine. It’s time to show these superstitious pigs how relative and subjective their bullshit “values” really are.

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    DietDan ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    @ Mister Thompson
    “everyone on this planet who has power has a responsibility to exercise it for the common good. Heck, even Spiderman gets that.”

    How true which is why I support self-regulation and the ESRB, as many other individual and organizations do including the FTC report you yourself have used in your posts. Of course you never do seem to want to admit that the report was pro-self regulation do you John Bruce. Legislation is not a synonym for the common good. Truth is in the common good; civility and professionalism are in the common good; fostering personal responsibility is in the common good. You stand for one I will continue to stand for and support those who stand for the others.

  24. 0
    Paige says:

    All the regulation and efforts by the video game, music and movie industries and the governments of the world are not going to come to much use if the problem isn’t nipped in the bud. Parents need more educational resources and programs made available to them by the community, not a nanny state who tells them how to control their children or an industry making their entertainment choices for them.

    Many people are having trouble with dealing with the incessant surge of technology and parents are having a worse time of it, whether they themselves grew up with video games or not. The only recourse many feel that they have is screaming at their federal member of parliament or whatever you may call your government member for regulations and stricter laws because they themselves don’t know what to do.

    Parents are looking to teachers to teach their children basic values and a whole host of subjects that those children will need in future because our society has become “live to work” instead of “work to live”. The prospect for many of getting home and cooking a wholesome family dinner and sitting down with their loved ones to share quality time is a distant memory for many of us, parents working so hard to survive in our society that their children are screaming for attention, acting out and turning to video games as both a source of something to do and a way of stirring the pot. I was a rebel myself as a teenager exactly for that reason because my own parents were always busy working to keep our family going.

    And it does seem like as soon as children hit school age, they’re dropped off at school and that’s where they learn everything from reading and counting to how to cook, clean and balance a budget while their parents try to keep all the bills under control. I’ll admit very freely that today’s society is becoming a very lonely place to live.

    I do believe that there needs to be an element of social responsibility within these companies and their products, but there also needs to be more awareness from society as a whole. I also believe there needs to be more support for parents, and more education available for them. Our own parents have either been so busy or so absent (in the case of single parent families) that the opportunities enjoyed by previous generations are no longer available to us now. I learned how to cook and clean as a stroke of luck than as a typical everyday chore like it was for my mother, I learned how to balance a budget purely through trial and error rather than growing up seeing how my parents did it.

    If our governments truly want to help the youth of the 21st century, they’ll stop jumping on the bandwagon of every moral panic that the media and other sensationalists create and start looking at how they can help the typical family, whether it’s through tax cuts, parenting courses or simply providing services along the lines of someone you can call at 2am because little Jimmy’s not home or little Sally’s got a cough, someone you can talk to about how to bring up a kid when your own parents don’t have the answers or you just don’t have the support there.

    I’d happily pay twice as much tax if parents were given the tools and resources to raise their own children and teachers were given the opportunity to teach what they should be teaching (ie english, maths, science etc) while the government stops making laws which are unconstitutional or just plain stupid (see Australia’s latest “net filter” for another example of a complete waste of money).

    All a nanny state is going to do is slowly turn our society into total anarchy and all pushing these companies is going to do is make them less inclined to go along with every new law and regulation. Responsibility is a two way street, parents need to get involved too and without the right tools at their disposal, the situation’s only going to get worse, no matter how much the governments lean on these poor companies.

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    AgnostoTheo ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    Think someone should break it to Thompson that the majority of gamers in this country ARE legally adults? You know, what with 51% of the gaming community being over the age of 18 and all?

    But why let facts get in the way, eh Jack? They’re just troublesome little things that get in the way of your moral crusade. God doesn’t believe in facts, so they must be sinful, right? Yeah. Go you and your entourage of lies. Have fun.

  26. 0
    Citizen_Snips says:

    man JT must have the biggest set of blinders on known to man. I wish I could look through his rose colored glasses, although something tells me I wouldn’t like what I see.

  27. 0
    Zoness says:

    @BB: Right

    Children kill children because they are all HUMAN and humans have moderately violent instincts, it happens and again MAYBE the media had something to do with it but I think the problem lies with the parents but they don’t get any of the heat because they are the ones voting to keep some of these people in office.

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    BearDogg-X says:

    @ Ivresse

    “Show me a man who’s never said ‘shit’ and I’ll show you a man full of shit.”- Chris Rock

    Your example is weak, since cursing has been pretty much legitimized to an extent, and the boss isn’t going to fire a person for one word.

    “If you’re going to tell a story about an ambiguous, ugly, brutal experience, I think one needs to be able to use ambiguous, ugly brutal language.”

    Besides that, if the current President and Vice President of the United States can curse during official duties and not be punished for it, why should anyone else?

  29. 0
    Ivresse says:

    Guys, I don’t like JT as much as you guys do, he’s vain, self-promoting, and let’s be honest, a bit of a numpty when it comes to knowledge about matters to do with video gaming. But he does bring one point across that, although I’m gonna hate myself for doing this, I have to agree with:

    Swearing profusely doesn’t get your point across.

    I mean lets face it, you have a brilliant idea for the company you work for, you’re about to present it to your boss, it’ll mean promotion and lots of extra money to get what you want. And you begin presenting it by saying:

    ‘Yeah, I think this idea is going to be f**king brilliant, because…’

    At this point, he’ll immediately stop you from talking, and probably fire you from the company as well for unprofessional conduct.

    Seriously guys, if you want to get a point across…less of the swearing okay? It just shows you as a foul-mouthed hooligan with nothing important to say rather than someone genuinely concerned and genuinely having a valid point to add to the topic…

  30. 0
    DavCube ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    “Cameron understands what teen gamers do not: That adults are in charge of this world and should be. Further, everyone on this planet who has power has a responsibility to exercise it for the common good. Heck, even Spiderman gets that.”

    What gamer thought gamers were in charge?

    “Thank God for MP Cameron, as adult leaders on both sides of the pond are understanding that pop culture is by and large raw sewage in which teens are drowning.”

    What culture do you suggest then, Mr. Thompson? None at all?

    “Once you kids grow up, you’ll understand. Until then, pay attention. You’ll learn something. Remember, I was once as ignorant as you. I grew up.”

    This coming from the person who continually spouts self-centered bullcrap like ‘I’m right and you’re not, so there.’ That kind of arguement stopped working around the age of four. YOU grow up.

    “What a calm and measured response that aids in proving that gamers are not socially mal-adjusted lunatics.”

    Oh wow. One person. Only tens of millions to go before you’ll have a case, Mr. Pot-Calling-Kettle-Black.

  31. 0
    BearDogg-X says:

    @ Jack Thompson

    One more thing:

    You’re the last person who should be talking about “pop culture being raw sewage”, when you’ve dipped into that so-called “moral sewer” everytime you mention Paducah, Columbine, Red Lake, Virginia Tech, that bullshit case in Alabama, the Cody Posey case in New Mexico, etc.

    Come to think of it, you’re an enabler, since everytime you go on TV whining about any video game, you advertise said game and its sales go up because of your whining.

    Practice what you preach, you petulant, childish assclown: Grow up and get a life.

  32. 0
    BearDogg-X says:

    @ Jack Thompson

    Quit lying to yourself and everyone else. You’ve never grown up. You’re the most ignorant fool I’ve ever heard.

    Here’s a movie quote for you:

    “That would be me. I was swimming in raw sewage. I love it! I LOVE IT!”- Lt. Frank Drebin, Police Squad, Naked Gun 2 1/2: The Smell of Fear

    Like I said, I’m 27 and if you think that’s a “kiddie” in your brain-dead logic, then your career and life has more serious problems than we ever thought.

    Practice what you preach, you petulant, childish assclown: Grow up and get a life. But I guess you don’t have the testicular fortitude to do that.

  33. 0
    odc04r ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    David Cameron talking like he understands the circumstances and culture that end up with kids running amok in the UK and commit crime like this (yes, I live there) just makes me laugh. How can an old etonian who sends his kids to private school ever understand how these kids think.

    It would be wonderful if all families could be loaded and upepr class – but funnily enough it doesnt work that way. How about setting some *serious* examples of persistant youth offenders so they have a little respect for the system.

    Desperation, boredom, knowing no other way and a lack of consequences for actions are the real causes of antisicial behaviour and crime over here.

    (I prefer the idea of kids that have nothing better to do playing games than hanging around and causing trouble tbh, irony indeed.)

  34. 0
    DarrelBT says:

    Well, if I had any doubts that JT was a rotten and spoiled troublemaker during his childhood, I have no regrets now. I mean, to say that “you were once like us but you’ve grown up” says a lot about what you were like back then. I could imagine what you’ve done during those times.

    Fun fact: The “Censor everything in the name of the children” crowd are almost ALWAYS the ones who had rotten childhoods and were troublemakers at their prime. When they grow up, they got so guilty of their actions that they believe they should police what people like because they believe every child is as rotten as they were. Too bad most of us here at Gamepolitics were good little boys and girls during our childhood. Or at least, we don’t get into a HUGE amount of trouble like whatever you did, JT.

  35. 0
    Scottland89 says:

    Jack Thompson STFU. Atleast some of the UK politicans are seeing the bigger picture. While your still narrow minded. Atleast DC is being semi sensible. However there are just mad f*ckers out there which do crazy stuff for no reason.

    Ohh btw, stop treating us like kids, I’m 18, and by law here (Scotland), I can go out drinking, gamble, watch\look at legal porn, and most importantly play games like GTA and Manhunt all I like.

    And if you think every kid will go crazy after playing games, then you need open your eyes, as I’ve played Doom, a game rated 15 in the Uk since I was 5 years old, supirviced by my father. Not once have I ever thought of turning a gun on anyone else…………

    ………bar in these laser shooting games and I quiet fancy going paintballing sometime as well as in “murder simulation” games.

    As the song, In the Summertime, by Mungo Jerry goes,

    “We’re no threat, people
    We’re not dirty, we’re not mean
    We love everybody but we do as we please”

    You may not relise it but 99.99% of gamers can sing that and be truthful, myself included.

  36. 0
    GoodRobotUs ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    In fairness, Jack simply copied someone else’s response to the all caps statement (A gamer, I might add). But if I were to copy and paste every stupid, rude or downright untrue thing that Jack had ever posted, I’d probably burn out the server.

  37. 0
    Erik ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    “Cameron understands what teen gamers do not: That adults are in charge of this world and should be. “

    Oh they are? Okay as I am 27 years old I decree that you shall stop trying to interfere with my hobby. I am in charge after all.

  38. 0
    Jesse Young says:

    That’s right, Jack, Cherry-pick one immature post and generalize half the world for it.

    What’s that? Almost all the other posts are well constructed and mature?

    Oh, don’t let that get in your way.

    Love how you lied about the whole ‘I’ll try not be be sarcastic anymore’ thing.

  39. 0
    Mr.Pat says:

    Btw Jack, I thought you told your “shrink” you were going to lay off the ad hominems – guessed you lied to him to, like you do most everyone else.

  40. 0
    Mr.Pat says:

    Jack Thompson, Attorney Says:

    August 25th, 2007 at 5:24 pm
    Cameron understands what teen gamers do not: That adults are in charge of this world and should be. Further, everyone on this planet who has power has a responsibility to exercise it for the common good. Heck, even Spiderman gets that.

    Thank God for MP Cameron, as adult leaders on both sides of the pond are understanding that pop culture is by and large raw sewage in which teens are drowning.

    Once you kids grow up, you’ll understand. Until then, pay attention. You’ll learn something. Remember, I was once as ignorant as you. I grew up.

    Jack Thompson

    PS: Hooah!

    Funny, I don’t consider becoming a bitter old man who wants to censor and/or ban everything he doesn’t like as growing up and admitting to trying to destroy companies he disagrees with. Maybe thats because I have better morals.

  41. 0
    GoodRobotUs ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    It just annoys me that people can spend their entire career attempting to paint their own stereotyped image of gamers purely to suit their own cause. Gamers are everything from Teachers to Astronauts, and yet the moment a political agenda appears on the Horizon this image is painted by the likes of the Anti-Gaming crowd.

    That’s why I get annoyed at Jacks’ comments (assuming that’s Jack) because I spent several years on here being insulted, belittled and called every name under the sun, along with the rest of GP, and yet Jack ‘conveniently’ forgets those occasions when he wants to climb onto his own persecution high-horse.

    It’s the selective amnesia that annoys me the most.

  42. 0
    PlayItBogart says:

    Actually, I’d like to delve more into what I said about religion causing more deaths than video games.

    It goes on everywhere. People killing infidels so they can go to heaven. Madmen interpreting the bible to justify horrific actions.

    Do I pigeon-hole all religious people as violent psychopaths with no regard for human life?

    No, because it’s a big tent and I know better than to compare Ned Flanders to Islamic Fascist #435429.

    Get where this is going?

    HINT: It has to do with video games.

  43. 0
    GoodRobotUs ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    ‘What a calm and measured response that aids in proving that gamers are not socially mal-adjusted lunatics.’

    Oh shut up and grow up Jack, you’re no better than the guy who types in capitals, as your own comment proves.

  44. 0
    PlayItBogart says:

    I dunno Jack, I’ve seen plenty of irresponsible adult leaders in my own time, let alone delving into history. Sometimes leadership ability isn’t related to one’s age.

    Without getting into a religious debate, more people have been killed in the name of God than in the name of GTA.

  45. 0
    GoodRobotUs ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    I would also like to add that only the 18-year old should have been playing games with any real level of violence in them, the 14 year old wouldn’t even be able to buy a 15 Certificate game legally. So, if these boys were all playing violent games or watching violent movies, some of them were doing so illegally.

  46. 0
    Jack Thompson, Attorney ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    Like I was saying:

    Luscan Says:

    August 25th, 2007 at 9:39 am

    What a calm and measured response that aids in proving that gamers are not socially mal-adjusted lunatics.

  47. 0
    Jack Thompson, Attorney ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    Cameron understands what teen gamers do not: That adults are in charge of this world and should be. Further, everyone on this planet who has power has a responsibility to exercise it for the common good. Heck, even Spiderman gets that.

    Thank God for MP Cameron, as adult leaders on both sides of the pond are understanding that pop culture is by and large raw sewage in which teens are drowning.

    Once you kids grow up, you’ll understand. Until then, pay attention. You’ll learn something. Remember, I was once as ignorant as you. I grew up.

    Jack Thompson

    PS: Hooah!

  48. 0
    Mnementh2230 ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    I wonder if they realize that kids these days, at least last I checked, aren’t any more violent than they were in the fifties?

    People have always been douche-bags to one another. We just sensationalize it more now (and I wish we didn’t – farking media). Guy needs to get a grip!

  49. 0
    GoodRobotUs ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    Cameron is a good speaker, but he’s also famous as an opportunist, he is good at spotting ‘hot button’ issues and riding them.

    All he needs to do now is learn when to tell the difference between Sensationalistic and Important. As much as I hate Maggie Thatcher, at least the 70/80’s generation of politicians seemed to figure out that the best way to deal with a trend was simply to ignore it for a few years until it died out.

  50. 0
    Lorenzo says:

    In a country where gun ownership is pretty much outlawed [with the exception of farms etc] A teenage kid allegedly shoots and murders a random child. Of course its the films/TV/video games that are to blame. Honestly.

  51. 0
    Snakestream ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    Well, now, here we come to another fan of the nanny state, albeit this response is somewhat more coherent than many have been up to this point. However, this constant string of crap from people who look upon freedom and intelligence with disdain irritates me to no end, so I am going to craft my anger into a response that I hope makes some sense to those critics who might read it. Puritanical thinkers might want to skip this entry.

    How the fuck have we come into this century when we keep celebrating democracy like it’s the greatest thing apart from oxygen and water, and yet, we still LONG and DEMAND for a motherfucking, all-encroaching government. I’ll admit this, Cameron doesn’t single games out, however, he just advocates what can only be described as a Lenin-like naivety, believing that everybody will band together and work for the good of society. STOP DAYDREAMING AND GROW THE FUCK UP. They already invented that: They called it Communism, and it crashed and burned. This kind of optimistic bullshit:

    “To me this is what social responsibility is all about. Not just sitting back and saying that the Government must act, but all of us saying, ‘This is my country, my society, my responsibility, and I must play my part.”

    Will never fly because, let’s face it, that kind of work ethic, determination, and loyalty exists in relatively few of us.

    “What has become of our society when we have this spate of children killing children?”

    Yeah, society has JUST become like this, ignore the fact that people have been killing other people for as long as there have been other people that just fucking piss them off. Ignore the fact that kids have been killing kids forever. Ignore the fact that gangs have formed, and that kids have joined them, for goddamn ever. NO. Society has JUST transformed into that godless age when children kill children. Goddamn man, try to think back to when YOU were a kid. Didn’t that one guy just piss you off so much that you dreamed of getting even? Now imagine that your parents pretty much ignore the fact that you exist, or worse, they beat your ass like there’s no tomorrow because they’re too much of pussies to go talk back to their boss. Add on the fact that the other kids don’t like you because you look weird, or talk weird, or maybe you’re just a dumb fucking piece of shit. Layer on that all-so-human desire to fit in, and to top it off, throw on that cocktail of hormones they call puberty. Yeah, it must be fucking SOCIETY that causes you to go out and join a gang or blast that jock asshole who’s been beating your ass everyday in school.

    On to the nanny state. Old fucking concept, get a goddamn new one. I’m not that familiar with the gun laws in the United Kingdom, but from what I have gathered, it is pretty damn hard to get a gun legally, and then you have to jump through hoops to show them that you’re storing it well (or you have to keep it at the local hunting club). Either way, it is supposed to be damn hard to get a gun and even harder to get something like a handgun which has been permanently banned if I’m not mistaken. So how the FUCK is it society’s fault when one little bastard gets a weapon and rides around on a bike, blasting other little kids? Answer this: Near the top of the responses, DoggySpew posted an article listing the best places to live. Topping the chart was the Netherlands, a hotbed of liberality with liberal outlooks on practically everything from drugs (I believe you are allowed to purchase small, recreational amounts of marijuana from the local cafe) to prostitution (it’s legal). In fact, unless I’m mistaken, the number of violent deaths (that’s including other forms of killing such as knives and drowning) is remarkably LOW compared to the UK and the US.


    How is this possible? Could it be that, when the government isn’t stamping their boots into your face and telling you what to do, people actually have to be RESPONSIBLE FOR THEIR ACTIONS?! OH MY FUCKING GOD. It’s like a motherfucking bolt of inspiration, glowing warmly on the faces of the ignorant and naive. Bottom line, government CAN’T tell people how to live every aspect of their lives; government exists as a general guideline and boundary to prevent extreme cases.

    Parents who did not know where their children were and what they were up to at night should not only be helped to do their job properly, they should be shamed into it, [Cameron] said.

    Well holy fuck, if the bastard doesn’t contradict himself. Is anyone dumb enough to think that, if the parents are too lazy to fucking keep track of where their children are on their own, government regulation will make them care any more? The cold truth is that this world, while it does have a large number of people who are level-headed, rational, and generally decent, is largely populated with bastards. Bastard-coated bastards with bastard filling. Especially with the explosion of life-lengthening medicines and liberal free-speech policies. You see, in the old days, these bastards would have simply died off because they needed SOME people to like them and help them out. But nowadays, these sons-of-bitches can live completely separate from society, ordering their food online, and doling out criticism while experiencing nothing firsthand that would soil their plastic bubble. Even worse, is when these fuckers find each other and procreate for some reason. Then, they raise a herd of little fuckers and beat them when “the world just ain’t fair, never mind that I didn’t pay attention in school or job training…” Then they get mad when their little fuckers go out smoking and boozing and generally fucking around. That is when we get goddamn complaints about the government not doing shit to control the population of deviant motherfuckers.


    End of that discussion. And when that kid goes out and blows some other guy’s head off, that is THAT KID’S fault. Oh yes, you see, no matter how fucking retarded you are, if you go out and kill someone, that is a CONSCIOUS choice. At that point, all blame goes to THE KILLER. Nobody else but THE KILLER. I am so fucking tired of all the goddamn bullshit “Society made me do it” fuck that people try to pull nowadays. Oh no, it was a video game’s fault that I went and gunned down that elementary school. Oh no, it was the Matrix’s fault that I pushed that guy out of the window to see if he could fly. Oh no, I read a bad BOOK, and it made me want to CUT A MOTHERFUCKER INTO TEN PIECES. Spare me your scapegoating shit. I am NOT deceived by your ridiculous crap, it was YOUR FAULT. ONLY YOUR FAULT.

    Oh yes, and at Dennis, It wasn’t Cameron who said the second part:

    The UK video games industry is obviously a vitally important part of our economy. The Government needs to do all it can to support the video games sector and allow it to flourish.

    I would, however, place equal weight on the cultural influence that games can have. As children and young people make up a significant proportion of video game users it is important for the industry to act in a responsible and sensitive way.

    Issues involving content have largely focused on the negative aspects associated with games. The arguments around Resistance: Fall of Man and Manchester Cathedral being the most recent example. The industry needs to accept it has a duty to act responsibly when it comes to appropriate content and politicians and the media needs to realise that the industry can have a positive impact on young people’s lives…

    I believe that it is time for the games industry to act in a responsible and sensitive way and play their part in the prevention of unsuitable material falling into the hands of children. It is essential that manufacturers take seriously the messages sent out by violent and increasingly life-like video games and I believe that most currently do so.

    It was some guy named Jeremy Hunt.

    *End Angry Tirade*

  52. 0
    European mum says:

    I continue to be surprised that in discussions like these people go from: it’s not the games! to it’s the parents! Sure, parents play a big role, one that I, as a parent, take very seriously. But lets not forget that those teens spend the majority of their time in schools. As a society, we decide that schools are important enough that parents should give up part of their responsibility and hand it over to the schools. However, schools are not the safe place they should be. With bullying by both teachers and students, and parents standing almost powerless against that, I do not understand why we never hear anything about the responsibility of the schools in these situations.
    (Disclaimer: I am not in the US or UK, but from what I read, schools do not differ that much and bullying is an issue everywhere).

  53. 0
    chris says:

    Well its still not the only thing cited, he basically questioned all the major cultural influences asking whether they are contributing to violence.

    all he is doing is doing the vague politician schtick untill the investigation is ongoing. or at least I hope he is.

  54. 0
    Amarkov says:

    They’re still complaining about Manchester Cathedral being in Resistance? If they had chosen to do the same thing in the Vatican, I would have been honored that my religion was considered so important that people would fight to clear aliens out of St. Peter’s.

  55. 0
    chris says:


    hes not making the link, hes asking the question if theres a link. Sure its political rhetoric for the same thing, but at least its not some JT alarmist crap;

    games = T3H MURDER!

    it opens the debate for a rational defence by the games industry rather than trying to ostracise them.

  56. 0
    Erik ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    No government has been able to prove that video games have caused any violent crimes. So how does he get off pointing the finger in this particular incident itself? No, first try to prove a link exists before you go linking individual cases. People fucking died and you are wasting your time mentioning video games, truly pathetic.

  57. 0
    chadachada ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    It isn’t the game industry’s responsibility to make sure all games are apropriate for 8-year-olds….It’s a collaboration of the industry, retailers, and the BBFC/ESRB and parents. But mostly the latter 3

  58. 0
    Rammsoldat says:

    The BBFC use the same set of ratings for movies as they do games yes. Its not really ass backwards as movies have been banned in the past too, they aren’t ganging up on the games. Most banned movies do see release down the line though as attitudes towards violence settle and new extremes are reached, i would imagine games would enjoy the same treatment as I’ve found the BBFC to be pretty fair in their affairs.

    The BBFC is an independant review panel who charge for each submission they rate. If you are refused a rating you have to pay to have it re-evaluated.

    I was thinking after i put up my previous comment. Now that there are both a British and European ratings on game boxes. mabye it wouldnt be a waste of time for an awareness campaign for the european ratings system (although its a fairly standard set of ratings)

  59. 0
    Citizen_Snips says:

    Actually i was kind of curious about that, do the ratings the BBFC use correspond to games AND movies? and if so isn’t that really ass backwards when they ban a game and not a movie?

  60. 0
    Rammsoldat says:

    This is true but we have the BBFC . Ratings still apply and the great thing about using the BBFC is that thry have been rating movies for years so there can;t be any excuse for not understanding the ratings.

  61. 0

    “I believe that it is time for the games industry to act in a responsible and sensitive way and play their part in the prevention of unsuitable material falling into the hands of children. It is essential that manufacturers take seriously the messages sent out by violent and increasingly life-like video games and I believe that most currently do so.”

    They do. It’s called the ratings board:

    ET, E, E 10+, T, M, A/O

    Industry job done.

    How about we all cut the bullshit and stop trying to have the government make laws for things the parents should be doing their-damn-selves?

  62. 0
    Terminator44 says:

    The main problem I had with that speech is it is overtly utopian. In the part about the availbilty of gangs and guns, he is clearly hinting at reforms in cities. In Britain, that can mean vastly expanded government programs. Problem is, many cities already have these programs and crime rates are still fairly persistant. These cities pass all sorts of gun-control legislation, but the long-term impact on gang-violence is insignificant. Heck, gangs still get firearms in a country where they are outright illegal, what does that tell you? These cities also spend millions to renovate their slums, but those efforts are largely futile. Even if you took the worst neighborhoods, bulldozed the buildings, and erected the most beautiful skyscrapers in their place, within a few years those buildings will be slums again and will be havens for gangs again. The problem isn’t with just parents of the community, it’s the design of cities that perpetuates these problems. The only way to even lessen the pain of urban living is to not overcrowd cities. Don’t build too many suburbs around these urban centers so they can expand with their population. Of course, it’s far too late for most cities. We can only hope that newer ones follow that basic plan.

    Now, to be fair, he also talks about parents a great deal. In his “social covenant” theory, he seems to hint that the community should be doing more to discourage bad parenting. This might work at first, and lots of people will probably get involved with Rhys fresh on their minds. However, as with cities, there is only so much they can do. Problem is, most of parental abuse and neglect occurs behind closed doors, where even neighbors can’t do very much. Also, as a comment on the Times article indicated, there are many different kinds of abuse and neglect, not all are obvious. There are parents who spoil their kids, there are parents who put one of their kids above his/her siblings. The community can’t reliably track down and stop these parents. The only certain way to lessen their impact on society is to nudge them out of the laziness which is so common in bad parents. Namely, put an end to excessive and unecessary state benefits to encourage these parents to find work. Though this won’t deal with all bad parents, a hard-working parent is a much better role-model than one who depends on welfare.

    About his comments on media, he brings up an interesting point, but one that should be taken with two jumbo grains of salt. One must be careful about blaming media, even in small part, for social ills. For example, in the 60s, many parents thought The Beatles were a bad influence on kids. But today, if I said they were even a minor factor in the rise of crime rates during that decade, I’d be laughed down the block. That’s the problem with ‘passing the buck’ to media, often our fears of it stem from the beliefs we pick up from the last generation. However, those beliefs change and become more flexible over time, and often we as a society are better off for it. Also, the issue of addressing the media becomes dicey in itself, because we are an imperfect society that searches for scapegoats there. Though Cameron’s remarks may not have been a condemnation of rap music of video games, they will certainly seem that way to Keith Vaz. Finally, the problem with tackling media in the name of social reform is itself flawed, as we do not yet know how the media contributes the social problems or if it contirbutes at all. We don’t even know if Rhys’ murderer was a fan of video games or rap. What we do know is that millions of people play violent video games and listen to swear-laden music and yet grow up to be normal, upstanding citizens. For the children who might be influenced in a negative way by these, I would refer back to my previous paragraph about the parents, because they have likely already failed the child by not teaching them good values to stand on, if the child must get them from the media. Besides which, it is also the parents who get these things for their kids in the first place. At worst, media likely plays a tiny role in some children going out and commiting crimes. Thus, our energies would be better spent on other issues, like addressing the deeper social problems. This is not carte blanche to stifle free expression in the name of “social responsibilty.” In too many societies this amounts to censorship based on arbitary views which STILL doesn’t address youth violence.

    In conclusion, this speech does SOUND good. You could make a catchy slogan out of it, and progressives will swarm on it like flies on honey. Taken as a whole, however, these ideas aren’t attainable. Throughout history, many attempts have been made to create a society like the one Cameron describes. To date, none have succeded on a national level.

  63. 0
    That_1_Guy says:

    Damn conservatists! Really there is more to the murder, so he should actually wait for the police to capture the killer then he can blame media. GOD!!

  64. 0
    MaskedPixelante ( User Karma: -1 ) says:

    It’s people like this that make me wonder…

    Was everyone immortal until Pong first hit bars across the world? Was when Ralph Baer invented the most primitive version of TV table tennis the same time people started dying?

  65. 0
    DBroad ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    The problem here in the UK is that the parents of problem kids give up and allow their kids free reign. The best part is that the government agency who are meant to step in and help the families regain control of their kids are too busy removing children from families for no reason other than to meet adoption quotas put in place by the government.
    I’ve been in stores and seen 14yr olds trying to buy a game rated 18. In one instance the store refused so the kid got his Dad who went ballistic at the fact they had denied sale to his kid and then purchased the game and gave it straight to his son. Rather than blaming the industries they should blame the parents.

  66. 0
    Rammsoldat says:

    This killing happened at a place i used to go to when i was a kid, its a damm shame. People are looking for a motive but i dont think they will find one as kids in that area somtimes atack each other for no reason. Hell one time when i was a kid i got punched in the face by some older lad riding by on a bike for no reason at all.

    Kids in this country have no fear of the law because there are no cosequences to their actions. They can destroy, steal and murder and not have to face up to the penalties for doing so.

    Before we start to complain about what kind of image the media is putting into kids heads we should be concerned about what kind of example the law is setting for them. The law is far too leniant on young offenders.

  67. 0
    Luscan says:


    Education and the financial background you come from effect the culture that you are exposed to. Richer more well educated folks will like more well read subjects and more intelligent programs. That’s why you never hear someone say ‘I’ve saved up my unemployment benefit so I can go and see the Vivaldi concert tonight’ or why you never hear upper class people say ‘Oh, turn off the blood Bronofski and put on Pop Idol would you?”

    Culture, Education and Finance are utterly inseperable.

  68. 0
    Wolf ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    @Andrew Eisen

    Yeah, that’s true. But what gets me is you can’t simply say it’s all cultural influences. Education and finances also play a role as well, and probably other things as well; while culture does play its role, you have to look at everything in the whole, not just cut a piece out and blame that particular section.

    If you want to fix something, you find out everything that’s wrong with it, not say “Oh, that needs fixing!” and then leave the rest unattended. You don’t call a house finished when it’s still missing the roof and a wall 😛

  69. 0
    Andrew Eisen ( User Karma: 0 ) says:


    Well, to be fair, Cameron is blaming society as a whole for perpetuating a culture where bad things like this can happen. Video games are a part of that culture but as Cameron points out, so are other forms of media, guns, drugs, alcohol, and crap parenting.

    Andrew Eisen

  70. 0
    shagrath says:

    “It means retailers stopping the sale of alcohol to young teenagers. It means music companies, media companies, games manufacturers”

    It means parents being involved in their children’s lives to the extent where they just might noticed if they’re involved in I don’t know… possessing a fire arm in a country where it’s illegal in any and all forms.

    I love how this dipstick just bypasses any responsibility by the shooter or the parents and goes right to cultural influences.

    I’m sick of listening to this crap, I’m so past done. You don’t get popular with parents by telling them it’s their fault their kids are dying, so you blame whatever is the most convenient.

    A viciously religious and devious lawyer, a quack psychiatrist who claims to solve years of emotional problems in a 10 minute segment, an elitist ex junkie MP… why is it these idiots make headlines constantly and specialists , who actually do research, are left twisting in the wind while these whores fight for the spotlight.

  71. 0
    DoggySpew ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    Yeah, I don’t know, but isn’t Britain the worst Western country to grow up in ?
    Let me see: Ah yes: http://society.guardian.co.uk/children/story/0,,2012512,00.html

    And surprise, surprise, which country is second to last ? Good ol’ USA. Seems there are more problems then the media in the UK.

    (And I’m proud that MY country is the BEST to grow up in.)

  72. 0
    Wolf ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    …so it was a drive-by. I’d like to call BS. I live in Michigan, and if you ever go to a place like downtown Saginaw, there’s drive-by’s all the time, and a lot of it is gang-related, not because some guys played a FPS.

    I mean, does he even know the daily lives of those arrested? Their interests, what they do in their spare time, etc. They may not be gamers, or care for TV, or whatever. Then what, hm?

  73. 0
    Tammej says:

    > “What has become of our society when we have this spate of children killing children?”

    Oh for crying out loud. Our society hasn’t *become* that way! It’s *always been* that way!

  74. 0
    Andrew Eisen ( User Karma: 0 ) says:



    Whoever’s responsible for Jones’s death, police are definitely looking at teenagers. Arrested so far are four boys (15, 15, 16, and 19) and two girls (15 and 18).

    So, some who meet the recommended age for M-rated games and some who don’t. Of course, they use a different ratings system in the UK but the point still stands.

    Andrew Eisen

  75. 0
    Luscan says:


    What a calm and measured response that aids in proving that gamers are not socially mal-adjusted lunatics.

  76. 0
    Michael ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    By the way, this guy did not even give out the age of the shooter. It sounds like the shooter could have been the age to play M rated games because usually most ride by shootings happen from adult aged people.

    GP: My bad for omitting the info on the shooters. I’ve added a link to the story. All arrested were teens.

  77. 0
    kurisu7885 ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    He repeated himself a few too many times, but I get his point. Basically, he does acknowledge that games are art and are a big part of our economy, but like the movie industry had to oh so long ago, they need to tread lightly until most of this haze clears.

  78. 0
    Michael ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    Before Jack Thompson and others go bezerk, most of the famous serial killers like Dahmer, Gacy, and so many others did those murders before very violent video games even existed.

    @Jack Thompson
    At least before you blow your stack answer to why all of these things happened even before very violent video games.

    Those people acted because of the way people in America started changing. Today people in America are getting ruder and ruder to innocent people for instance. That is the reason why all of the school shootings so on and so forth are happening.

    And as for the situation of some of the shooter playing video games, most kids these days play video games.

  79. 0
    Luscan says:

    I don’t really have a huge problem with him saying this although I can imagine there will be some out there that think that it’s the end of the world and the politicians are trying to ruin videogames again or something. Cameron makes a few interesting points and also a few concessions. He says that he respects the cultural impact that games can have, almost like he respects them as an art form.

    He’s not blaming the media. He’s saying ‘there there is a lot of blame to go around here.’ Hell, he even says that the politicians are at fault here too.

    Also, GP, it wasn’t really a ‘Slam’. The headline is rather sensational!

  80. 0
    Ben Yaka ( User Karma: 0 ) says:

    Seriously how come every time some nutsu kills someone how is it automatically the media’s fault? What about 50 years ago when there werent video games? Who was there to blame back then?

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