@ Mark Lucherini

I hope your right. I would rather not have censorship video games.

@Shaesyco:

No...the only thing the ESRB has to do is point out that their ratings should be paid attention to. The other thing to point out is that the hacked game is not Rockstar's product once it has been modified outside of retail.

@ Shaesyco

What? They haven't announced the results yet.

You know, there really is no reason for there to be an investigation here. It's not like Rockstar hid something in the game to make the blur go away. Especially when, in actuality, something is being REMOVED from the game to get rid of the blur, specifically, a few lines in some configuration files. It's not like this is some huge thing. This isn't going to make kids all go out and start murdering people, as much as Thompson would like them to, that sick sick freak. Besides the fact that, like I know has been mentioned before, this whole hack revolves around having an illegal copy of the game to begin with.

This is fearmongering at it's best. And with nazis like Jack backing it up, you know it'll be all over the news, as well. And all that's going to end up doing is selling more copies. End of story.

@ Shaesyco

"Stupid GP Readers jumping to conclusions again"

There fixed that for you.

@ E. Zachary Knight
not really jumping to conclusions. Rockstar seems to cause the most problems so why wouldn't the ESRB use it to their advantage and slam them with a phony fine so that the watchdog groups will back off.

Hmm...any way to get in on that conference call? :D

@ Weighted Companion Cube

ok hers the deal. you know it isn't the official version. so do i and the ESRB. the problem is The Watch Dog groups don't care and/or just haven't figured it out yet.

I want to know whose concerns is she trying to address? Who does she work for, the concerned citizens of America, Common Sense Media, Jack Thompson Pseudo Attorney, whose concerns?

@ Shaesyco

The watchdog groups should have no say in what the ESRB does - if they do, then the ESRB isn't actually doing their job

Actually, it makes sense for the ESRB to perform an investigation. They probably looked at the hack, then back at the submitted game and are determining whether this content was reported and if it's easily accessible. So, hopefully, they'll be coming out in a few hours and saying "All of this content was reported to the ESRB per our guidelines. The content is *not* accessible in the finished version of the game, and requires illegal modifcation of the hardware. We will not be issuing a rerating of the game."

I still do not understand how the ESRB is answerable to Self appointed watchdog groups anymore than they are answerable to JBT The PTC and such have no authority.

The ESRB does not write or dissemble code so do not control what is put into the game. I am hoping that they admit that they were advised of the loose codes and still gave the M rating after consideration.

@ Icehawk

But since they are in charge of rating games some people feeling they should know everything about them.

@ Shaesyco and Icehawk

The ESRB is answerable to these watchdog groups to the same extent that they are answerable to every person buying a game. If the ESRB gets enough complaints about a games rating, they would do a great diservice by not investigating it. If they ignored these watchdog groups, they would damgae their reputaion far greater than whatever they say after this report.

Oh please, the games has been out for only two days now and everyone is getting all worked up over something HACKERS did.

@ Missy

Exactly, the watchdog groups are not going to be happy until Rockstar is destroyed

@Missy and DAN:

Yeah, they really hate R* it seems and intend to crushing them into the ground.

@BlackIce

My victory song would be Metallica's 'Don't Tread on Me'

@jds

I'll take Paradise City.

Hmmm... Hurm... I think I want "Tribute" as my song.

I'm sure alot of other publishers would love to see R* bite the bullet. Not because they're competition, but because I think there's some back room grumbling with alot of industry heads that say R* has gone WAYYYYYYY too far this time.

No, no, no, I change my victory song to, 'Prison Sex'.

I voted for it before I voted against it.

WHERE DO I GO TO GET REALTIME UPDATE AS TO THE STATUS OF THE CALL. WANT TO BUY SOME PUTS ON TTWO IF THE NEWS IS NEGATIVE!!!

Thanks

@E.ZK

Hopefully. If Jack isn't chasing him down the street.

@jds

Let's put it ths way - Jack will make a great vegie.

2:30 has come and gone.

I'd like to hear EXACTLY what was said BEFORE the lawsuit slinger from Miami puts his spin on the boards.

It's almost funny houw the reactions of the watchdog groups are more violent than the game itself.

Hear them now coming down the street with their pitchforks and torches...

@ BlackIce

A while ago, Game Politics had an article about John Bruce having some heart trouble. I was making a jab at that. ;)

You forgot the word "hooah"

Well I hope the content of the call are released prior to mkt close. Good lord puhleeeze

Er...d'oh! Wrong thread!

*shamed*

Here's to hoping the ESRB did the right thing and told those groups to piss off. Though with how they've been lately I wouldn't be surprised seeing them playing a dumb victim and making themselves look ten times worse. I'm still sure even if the executions weren't distorted the game would have got a M rating anyway. I'm not very far into the game as I can only got about 15 to 20 minutes at a time before boredom sets in.

Courtesy of firingsquad:

ESRB Statement On Keeping Manhunt 2's M Rating

The Entertainment Software Ratings Board now has the full statement from its president Patricia Vance on keeping the M rating for Manhunt 2 even with the hacked code on the PSP version:

Manhunt 2 was rated Mature by the ESRB for ages 17 and older for Intense Violence, Blood and Gore, Strong Language, Strong Sexual Content and Use of Drugs.

Earlier this week we learned about a hack into the code of the PSP and PS2 versions of the game that removes special effects filters that were put in place to obscure certain violent depictions. We have investigated the matter and concluded that unauthorized versions of the game have been released on the Internet along with instructions on how to modify the code to remove the special effects. Once numerous changes to the game's code have been made and other unauthorized software programs have been downloaded to the hardware device which circumvent security controls that prevent unauthorized games from being played on that hardware, a player can view unobscured versions of certain violent acts in the game. Contrary to some reports, however, we do not believe these modifications fully restore the product to the version that originally received an AO rating, nor is this a matter of unlocking content.

Our investigation indicates that the game's publisher disclosed to the ESRB all pertinent content in the authorized Mature-rated version of Manhunt 2 now available in stores, and complied with our guidelines on full disclosure of content.

What parents, and indeed all consumers, need to be aware of is that computer software and hardware devices are susceptible to unauthorized modification. Parents should be cognizant of whether or not their children are engaging in unauthorized modification of their games, consoles or handhelds, as those modifications can change game content in ways that may be inconsistent with the assigned ESRB rating. That being said, the vast majority of consumers have not made the unauthorized modifications to their hardware necessary to view the content at issue.

ESRB president Patricia Vance said:

“Manhunt 2's rating makes it unmistakable that the game is intended for an older audience. The unauthorized hacking into the code of this game doesn't change that basic fact.

“Parents need to be vigilant about monitoring what their children are downloading on the Internet and ensure that they are not making unauthorized and oftentimes illegal modifications to software and hardware that remove the controls the industry has so diligently put in place for their own protection."

Q&A

How is this situation different from the “Hot Coffee” incident?

The Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas “Hot Coffee” situation involved a scene that was a) fully rendered in an unmodified form on the disc (the Hot Coffee mod did not alter the content that was there, it merely unlocked it), b) not previously disclosed to the ESRB during the rating process, and c) easily accessible to all owners of the PC version of the game. Conversely, in the case of Manhunt 2, a) content that was programmed to be part of the game (i.e., visual blurring effects of certain violent depictions) is being modified, b) the content was previously disclosed to the ESRB, and c) unauthorized versions of software and/or hardware are required to play the modified content.

How is this situation different from the one with “The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion?”

After the release of The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion, the ESRB discovered extensive amounts of fully rendered and previously undisclosed blood and gore in the game that warranted a Mature rating. In addition, there was a fully rendered anatomically detailed art file of a topless female character present on the disc that had not been previously disclosed to the ESRB during the rating process. The blood and gore was accessible to all owners of the PC and Xbox 360 versions of the game. The partial nudity was accessible to all owners of the PC version of the game if they downloaded a modification available on the Internet that replaced one version of character artwork for another, both of which existed in a fully rendered form on the disc. Conversely, with Manhunt 2, a) the content in question was previously disclosed to the ESRB, b) the content is being modified by removing the obscuring blur effect that was programmed as part of the game, and c) unauthorized versions of software and/or hardware are required to play the modified content.

Why does this instance not fall under the ESRB’s disclosure rule clarification requiring that locked-out content contained in the code on a game disc be considered in the assignment of a rating?

Our rule clarification following Hot Coffee required that pertinent content that is programmed to be locked out but which exists in an unmodified, fully rendered form on game discs must either be removed or disclosed to ESRB during the rating process. In the case of Manhunt 2, the scenes in question were playable (not locked-out), programmed to include the blur effect, and fully disclosed to the ESRB.

Just finished reading that guy's posts in other threads. More repeating of articles containing other's opinions, more copies of his interpretation of the situation, more prattling on about threats he received without bothering to include a copy to show he's not lying (or what he considers a "threat"... same old, same old.

Still no proof on anything; it's all jumping to conclusions. Now we continue to wait for THIS investigation's results to be announced.

While I'm against censorship in games and in favour of the ESRB and other similar rating boards doing their work, there *is* one valid concern: that R* apparently didn't *remove* content from the game, they just restricted access to it. Admittedly, the restricted access is better than including the content as an easter egg, to be activated somehow in-game, but as far as I know, there's no precedent, legal or otherwise, about whether "inaccessible" content on the disc should count towards the rating. It'd be one thing if people managed to insert their own AO-worthy content into a game via mods or proper hacking, but this is R*'s content. It wouldn't have been that hard for R* to modify their build process to disallow the offending code from being compiled and remove any offending images and other media from their build pipeline, so it's probably a bit of a stretch to assume they're totally innocent in this.

That said, the fact that it took hackers using illegally modified hardware to access the content is a pretty weak argument against R* and the game, and I would hope that it would be shot down. All I'm doing here is trying to highlight one fact that perhaps both sides are willing to ignore.

They don't need to announce the results, because we know what's going to happen.

Grunt Birthday Party!

@Samson Effect, Gordon Freeman Edition

"Samson Effect, Gordon Freeman Edition"

This means War.

@HackAngel

And as before, not yet a mention of Manhunt 2 anywhere in Montreal, even with the hack “scandal”.

Ditto in the prairies...

Here in Oklahoma, we had no coverage of Manhunt 2. Of course, I don't watch the news so I may be wrong. At least Newsok.com didn't have anything as of yesterday.

@Jabr:

Likewise in Ontario.

@BlackIce:

You have a problem with the Freeman? I just popped that in there because I picked up Orange Box, and am playing through Half-Life 2, and like Gordon, I am a physicist (although admittedly not nearly as good of one; I'm still working on my Bachelor's, which is a good many years off of a Ph. D.)

Oh wait.. I've changed my name..

Well, you might be confused about now, so let me explain it:
Before October 31st, my screenname was "Blackice, NKVD Edtion" Your name is very similar to what it was. So, I thought you ripped it off.