Advocate for the Mentally Ill Takes a Second Swipe at Manhunt 2

Advocate for the Mentally Ill Takes a Second Swipe at Manhunt 2

November 19, 2007
Recently GamePolitics reported that Mike Fitzpatrick, executive director of the National Alliance on Mental Illness (NAMI) had chastised Rockstar Games over Manhunt 2.

In that first go-round, Fitzpatrick expressed concerns that depicting protagonst killer Daniel Lamb as an escaped mental patient only served to reinforce negative stereotypes of the mentally ill. Fitzpatrick has subsequently given an extensive interview on Manhunt 2 to The Wiire. Among his comments:
The degree of controversy, I think, around Manhunt 2, provides a really exceptional opportunity - really, a teaching moment, to help us raise awareness... Frankly, we like it better when we can praise companies instead of push them...

We understand, frankly - to be blunt - that [Rockstar] makes millions of dollars of profit on [Manhunt 2]. And to stigmatize in the way [that Manhunt 2 does] comes at, really, a social cost... we would say to this company, and the video game industry, that you do have a responsibility to your community. We're not against video games...

One in four Americans experience mental illness at some point in their lives. I can assure you that many of our [NAMI] members play video games... The reality is, mental illness is an illness like any other. You don't create video games that make fun of people with cancer, or heart attacks...

Comments

I'm going to have to disagree with what he's trying to say here.
Put simply, on this or any other issue, I don't see why the fact that it's in a game makes it different, in any way, from how the same issues are portrayed in other media.

It's not like the escaped mental patient murderer is a foreign concept in slasher flicks, which is where Manhunt draws its inspiration.

I have no love at all for the franchise, but I frankly don't understand or agree with a lot of the flak it receives.
>> You don’t create video games that make fun of people with cancer, or heart attacks

No, but you can use disease -- e.g. cancer, heart attacks, mental illness -- as the launching point for stories. Should there not be "Tuesdays with Morrie" just because people suffer from Lou Gehrig's syndrome? How about 'A Streetcar Named Desire'? I'm pretty sure the elevator didn't make it to Blanche Dubois' penthouse. I'm pretty sure diabetics really didn't care how they were portrayed in 'Steel Magnolias.'
Dude needs to go in a eval...his comperhention and ability to understand reality is failing....
@Channing This is true that the diabetics, cancer patients and a multitude of other people suffering from illness may not care how they are portrayed in those movies, books and other media forms. But they don't deal with the same issues that mentally ill patients do. There is a stigma associated with mentally ill people that this game plays upon, giving another re-enforcement of this stigma that people suffering from psychological diseases tend to me psychotic, or maniacal.

I would have to, in this case, agree with Flitzpatrick and say Rockstar does have some form of responsibility towards this community for how they're portraying them. It's unfair to them to have another thing to fight against. There are a vast number of movies, and books that portray these people as killers and crazies and they really don't need another thing to fight against.
Listening to him talk the first time around was like..... brain poison.
As a person who suffers from depression, I can understand where the guy is coming from. But I haven't been bothered in the least by Manhunt 2's depictions of anything, for two reasons. 1: I haven't played the game. 2: Fiction has to get a lot of the facts wrong about something before I get bothered by it (or a little if it is a major plot point).
I dont think he has anything against videogames. Im sure he just saw an opportunity to puplish his organization for free, and ofcorse remember kids, if all the cool kids are doing it (the goverment), you should to.
So, while he is giving statistics on how many individiuals have mental illness, maybe he ought to give statistics on how many have been experimented on by questionable organizations or individuals. After all, the experimentation on the mentally ill, using them as guinea pigs for unscrupulous "professionals" is also an important issue.

Many TV shows, movies, and books have also been done about scientists who have abused their power and experimented on individuals medically and even on the minds of various types of citizens. This, in fact, no different.

Nightwng2000
NW2K Software
@Nightwng2000:

"So, while he is giving statistics on how many individiuals have mental illness, maybe he ought to give statistics on how many have been experimented on by questionable organizations or individuals. After all, the experimentation on the mentally ill, using them as guinea pigs for unscrupulous “professionals” is also an important issue."

This is exactly the point. The game is about a man who wakes up in an asylum and doesn't know why he is there. He isn't mentally ill at all, just held against his will and being experimented on, and makes an unfortunately violent escape. The game does not portray mentally ill people in a bad light, unless Mr. Fitzpatrick is admitting that mentally ill people are held against their will and experimented on...
I suffer from amental illness and have even spent time in a mental home for it.

I dont find manhunt 2 to be offensive at all, in fact if anything the fact it deals with issues that i can relate to make me more interested in the game itself.
Let's give more publicity to a game destined to be on the discount racks in three weeks!
That mans love of commas and hatred of periods made my eye twitch. As for what he said, I can understand where he is coming from a bit. I think he is just a bit overprotective. The more you care the easier you are to offend.
It's also giving these idiots something to bitch about, thus publicity for them! Just like groups that bitched about Me, Myself and Irene or the one that the "represented" the blind that bitched about the Mr.Magoo movie from several years back. Every year, we get more hypersensitive wussies bitching and moaning about what they don't like and cry ignorance or whatever. The best part is that most of the time these people are the ones who are really ignorant in not knowing or maybe just ignoring the facts of whatever it is they're complaining about so they can get the attention they want.
We’re not against video games...

Just this one...

That's as bad as the cliched "I don't mean to be insulting (but I will be anyway)..."
Wait, who are these people again? I didn't know they existed until the LAST article on GP. I'll probably forget again in 3...2...1...bzzt.
"The degree of controversy, I think, around Manhunt 2, provides a really exceptional opportunity"

At least they admit to being publicity whores, unlike some people out there...

Honestly, I don't disagree with this guy. At least with respect to what he's doing, not necessarily the point he is making.

I think that making more people aware of how serious and common mental illness really is can be a great thing, and this is a good opportunity to do that.

However, criticizing a work of fiction because they don't approve of a character is not a smart move for anyone. It's fiction.

I know you think Harry Potter is an evil sorcerer that will corrupt our Christian children. Sure, Nelson from The Simpsons glorifies childhood bullies. Of course bears don't have decorated bellies that shoot forth care, love and happiness, and if a child were to approach a bear they would likely be devoured...

... But it's all still just fiction. Move on.
He has a point. Don't be so single-minding to not understand it. He is making it known that unfairly stereotyping those who are mentally ill isn't fun and games.
Thomas P.,
But it's also important to Publicize, even through fictional stories, what can go seriously wrong with unscrupulous organizations and individuals when they tamper with things they don't fully understand. It's also important to publicize, even through fiction, the abuses that the average citizen, or the mentally ill, can be put through in the name of "science".

Nightwng2000
NW2K Software
My comment from the first swipe still stands. If this were a movie. No one. Not one bloody person would say one god damned thing. Not even one word. But a videogame? It's as if they can't shut up!

- Warren Lewis
"My comment from the first swipe still stands. If this were a movie. No one. Not one bloody person would say one god damned thing. Not even one word. But a videogame? It’s as if they can’t shut up!"

Then venture onto the NAMI site and see how many issues they've had with movies. MY comment from last time still stands: the reason you do not hear about NAMI criticising movies on this blog is because this blog does not cover movies. It covers games.
@Mike Fitzpatrick

until you start attacking books, movies, pictures, and all other forms of media that stigmatize the mentally Ill, shut the f--- up,
I had a guy trade in the game the other day when I was working. I asked him if it was any good, and his response was "Oh hell no"

I'd wager it was just another game that got overhyped by people scared of it. GG media.
Whatever happened to the days when if you didn't like something, you simply ignored it? If this game offends you, don't buy it. Simple. Some people feel that for some reason if they don't like it, it needs to be banned.
Radio Guy
thats the problem with PCisim and moralisim it wants to protect people from life by banning it!
I would make a game that makes fun of cancer and heart attacks. Why not? anything can be funny. and anything can be a game. if people have fun with it, if they enjoy it, who cares about the content. YOU don't have to play it. if YOU don't want to. It does not affect you if other play it.

leave it alone.
@Dogstew

I didn't mean to make light of mental illness. But part of the stigma associated couldn't part of the stigma associated with the disease perhaps be due to the fact that sufferers very often do -- for lack of a better description -- crazy things? Today a suicidal driver hit a semi head-on in Phoenix (http://www.kpho.com/news/14637952/detail.html). Last week a teen threatened police in NYC with what he said was gun until they had to shoot him. (http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/11/13/ny.shooting/index.html).

I wish there were a way to make treatment available for all those who need it, but until there is, these acts are real and far too common. As with other diseases, from alcoholism to obesity to schizophrenia, I don't see anything wrong with using this reality in works of fiction.
Millions of dollars of profit?

Bear in mind the length of time it's been in development, retailers pulling it from shelves, and ratings boards banning it. Then bear in mind that it hasn't exactly lit the charts on fire and has since descended into obscurity with the Christmas charge of high-profile releases such as Super Mario Galaxy, Mass Effect, Halo 3, and Assassin's Creed.

Frankly they'd be lucky to break even.
You know I just gonna end up saying what I said in the other article so here it is:

"I understand NAMI’s issues because I for one know and seen some mental illnesses that are not violent; however, I have to say that in any media where there is a relatively mediocre entertainment there will be stereotypes and that’s a fact that we have to live with. The human race is too jugdemental and even though we can supress/dispell hatred of minorities we cannot run from stereotypes."

Regarding Manhunt 2, the game is just that, mediocre entertainment. Like in so many other stories, you have your stereotypes due to the complete lack of originality from the creator. You're just gonna have to live with it.
From my understanding the story of Manhunt 2 actually shares some simlarities to stephen kings the firestarter (only without the weird powers).

You are the guinea pig in an experiment involving some weird drug (lot 6) for the military. The experiment goes horribly wrong and you're placed in an insane asylum to keep you away from the public and to keep word of the exeperiment from leaking to the public. You escape from the asylum and are now on the lam and must avoid the people who worked at the asylum. (Only in firestarter they started on the lam then got caught and thrown in the asylum place). This is what I gained from the previews so if I'm wrong I apoligise.
Boy this guy is going to be mad about Kane and Lynch then.
These guys would flip out if they saw Twisted Metal Black.
Yeah Twisted Metal Black was people fresh out of an asylem. You know i never though anyone could be more scared of their own shadow. How long has it been since Jack Las made a post. I'm gonna have to find one i could use a good laugh.
Condemned Criminal Origins has mentally ill people in it. Since it's a video game it's making fun of them ,so why haven't they said anything about that?
what about american mcgee's alice? the whole plot of that game revolved around alices mental condition.
The stigma against mental illness is so great, it makes this man's reasonable statement sound like inane raving. There is so much work to be done here, it's practically spitting in the wind to single out MH2. But he's right in that it's a prominent teaching opportunity.

I can think of very few games that have approached mental illness in a sensitive manner. Which is too bad, because the possibilities are fantastic.
Geekwad, well said! I agree wholeheartedly.

He saw an opportunity to say something and have some people listen to it. I'm sure he's just as bothered by the negative stigmatizing portrayal of mental illness in other forms of the media
Ladies and gentleman of the world, I come before you to tell you that the world is changing. The world found out that the brain is very different then they thought it was. Many people are suffering. Who you may ask? I’ll tell you, it’s your sons, your daughters, and even your parents. It’s called mental disorders, and many people have them. The symptoms can range from hypertension, to staying up all night scared for your life thinking some ones going to kill your whole family. Mental disorders are a serious thing and there everywhere and they don’t get the respect they deserve. Businesses everywhere fire people for things they can’t help. Why you may ask: Ignorance, and hate for every thing that’s different. Throughout time people hated many other people. First Egyptians enslaved random African tribes out of hate. Then Romans were hated, then Greeks, then blacks, then Jews. Now people with mental disorders are a subject to hate. our whole lives we are made fun of, people beat us up, we fail our classes, we never have girl friends and are punished by our parents and that’s just the first half of our lives, all because all because of “normal” peoples ignorance of mental disorders. I didn’t even mention when we grow older we will be refused jobs, not have friends, and never be respected. That’s why I come to you today, to make this ignorance stop. Please join me in my fight to make mental disorders not only understood but thought of as an every day thing.
They say they have organizations for us like mental hospitals but I been in those places and the whole time I was in there they acted like they were punishing me. Should I be punished for things I can not help? And there’s an other organization called 7 counties, but when I was with them the guy that was supposed to help me never showed up he just kept making up excuses. All that goes to show you what the government thinks of people with mental disorders. They pretend to want to help but they in turn do the bare minimum.
From the web sight http://www.cmha.ca/bins/content_page.asp?cid=3 this experts says “There are many myths about mental illness. Until people learn the truth, they will continue to deny that mental illness exists at all or to avoid the topic entirely.
How much do you know about mental illness? Here are some of the common myths -and truths.
• People with mental illness are violent and dangerous. The truth is that, as a group, mentally ill people are no more violent than any other group. In fact, they are far more likely to be the victims of violence than to be violent themselves.
• People with mental illness are poor and/or less intelligent. Many studies show that most mentally ill people have average or above-average intelligence. Mental illness, like physical illness, can affect anyone regardless of intelligence, social class or income level.
• Mental illness is caused by a personal weakness. A mental illness is not a character flaw. It is an illness, and it has nothing to do with being weak or lacking will-power. Although people with mental illness can play a big part in their own recovery, they did not choose to become ill, and they are not lazy because they cannot just "snap out of it."
Mental illness is a single, rare disorder. Mental illness is not a single disease but a broad classification for many disorders. Anxiety, depression, schizophrenia, personality disorders, eating disorders and organic brain disorders can cause misery, tears and missed opportunities for thousands of people.
Words can hurt
Words like "crazy," "cuckoo," "psycho," "wacko" and "nutso" are just a few examples of words that keep the stigma of mental illness alive. These words belittle and offend people with mental health problems. Many of us use them without intending any harm. Just as we wouldn't mock someone for having a physical illness like cancer or heart disease, it is cruel to make fun of someone with a mental illness.”
Re: Advocate for the Mentally Ill Takes a Second Swipe at
We have enough mentally ill persons to deal with in our real lives, do we really need some in our games? What happened to the fun, happy games of our childhood? I think I'm gonna write a letter to a offshore corporation asking them why they sell violence.

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