America's Army is a game that should never have been created. The government shouldn't be making video games with false information in it to recruit people for military service. Its widely known that AA contains false information about what "real war" is about. You don't see your best friend getting killed, you don't see the massacre of civilians, you don't see the aftermath of war, and you don't see the psychological toll it takes on people who do return unscathed.

Frankly, I'd never play AA. I'll pay out money and play a real shooter kthx.

@Gamer1001
That was one of the most ignorant statements I've ever heard. I could go into a long ramble about how you're making a sweeping generalization about an entire culture based on a few radicals, and how it's *gasp* naive to think that our government is in this "war on terror" for just ALL of the right reasons (/sarcasm), but suffice it to say you sound like an ignorant prick, and just like the type of person that's giving Islamic radicals just another example of American ignorance to use for the purposes of demeaning the entire country. I'm starting to think that people here will never start to fucking grow up and maybe realize that their MIGHT be a few reasons for other countries to detest us, and that we're not always "the good guys". Sorry for ranting.

"These visual games are a perfect opportunity to psychologically prepare and even mentally train children to fight in battle…"

A muslim Jack Thompson?

Tyler,
No, a LaRouche copy-cat.

Nightwng2000
NW2K Software

Videogames are preferable to Machine Guns and Grenades.

An Islamic youth complaining about brain-washing and and desensitization...

I wonder if this guy has a sense of humor because that's pretty funny.

In all seriousness, the messed up state of affairs all over the middle-east is not the public's fault. I wonder where they get the idea that all American's want to Rambo their way through the internal organs of every Iraqi. Then again, the rest of the world hates us because the biggest thing we export is bad TV shows and movies.

This poor idiot probably thinks we're all flag waving psychopaths with guns... Which is pretty ironic if you ask me.

This guy fails. If America's Army was a way to brainwash the youth into enlisting then why is there such a push to find new soldiers? Why are there enlistment bonuses of up to $40k? Why are troops being forced into 15 month deployments? It's because there aren't enough troops because young people are not enlisting.

It's just like people who claim that video games are causing violence when the numbers show that violent crime is decreasing. How can America's Army be brainwashing people to join the military if there have been fewer and fewer recruits since the game was released?

"Computer War-games have increased tenfolds (sic) since the global war on terrorism invaded our minds and ears in 2001, with most of the games targeted towards a young audience…"
somehow, i think not.


"These visual games are a perfect opportunity to psychologically prepare and even mentally train children to fight in battle…"
strangely, i think computer games don't convey all the suspense and emotion contained within a battlefield. i dont know any gamers who got post-traumatic stress from playing computer games. (FEAR doesn't count)


"There is no doubt that this well-thought tactic, issued by high-ranking govermental officials, and it is not very surprising. The global war on terrorism is running out of soldiers, as US officials have said…"
"no doubt that this well-thought tactic"
"well-thought tactic"
"thought"
no, the government is not capable of being that devious.
besdies, i dont seriously believe they're running out of soldiers, more like targets.


"Brainwashing the youth to fight in almost real-life situations which a solider would face if fighting in Iraq for instance, is most definitely a way to recruit more soldiers for the future…"
basically, that sentance failed at the first word.
seriously, these games just dont convey the realism of combat, so they cant realistically train people for it, insert whole 'mouse vs rifle' argument here.


on a side note, i think "the pen is mightier than the sword" needs updated to "the blog is mightier than the rifle" or something similar. thoughts?

I'm sorry but you lead an incredibly charmed life if you think that a videogame can prepare someone for "almost real-life situations which a solider would face if fighting in Iraq".

And I agree, this obviously isn't a very effective brainwashing tool since the Army is constantly missing its recruitment goals.

I play AA, but I wouldn't PAY to play it.

Fuck that noise.

Honestly, I don't know what the EMY has to stand on, look at all the games made in Palestine about shooting Jews, making bombs, and my personal favorite, blowing up buildings along the gaza strip.

i must say, it is not entirely unreasonable, the stance the group has taken. In my experience with America's Army, it does seem, like many modern war games, to strictly portray the U.S. as heroes and, perhaps intentionally, portrays the enemies as arab the entire time. In one of the PC versions i have seen played, i noticed that no matter what side you are on in the online battles, you are always portrayed as a U.S. soldier and the opposing players always look like arabs. It may not be a very effective recruitment tool, and it certainly isnt training anyone to be soldiers, but the game does nothing if not encourage the mindset that arabs are the enemy. I, personally, would like to see a game about modern war that depicts the positive and negatives of both cultures.

@OP

Wow, that sucks.

And people say that BF2 and Call of Duty 4 are biased against arabs. Heck, at least in those you can PLAY as the arabs and give the Americans a taste of their own medicine.

Hmmm... Sucks to be us. No rest for the wicked. I find it comically odd that a site dedicated to supporting a philosophy oriented around total control would even bitch about such things. The hypocrisy in this world is epic in this day and age. What next a jihad on the US Army? As if...

BTW: I support the game (I do not play it however). I think it is a very useful educational tool despite its short comings.

"This poor idiot probably thinks we’re all flag waving psychopaths with guns…"

I think this is one of the best statements of our time that has ever been said on this site.

Think of it. Our governments and media tell us that all mid-easterners are crazy religious fundamentalists. This, of course, cannot be true but most believe it. If EVERY muslem in Iraq and Iran rose up, the occupation would be over in days.

On their side, their government and media are likely telling them that we westerners are oil thirsty bandits intent on enslaving their country and raking what is rightfully theirs. AND if that were true, then the US would not have invaded the way they did.

So here we are: stakeholders feed into the stereotype and we either believe it or scoff at it.

The game I believe was more designed to get potential soldiers to join up with the Army :p, I don't believe it's brainwashing at all.

its just a recruitment tecnique. not brainwashing. no matter what, i'll always prefer that recriuters use americas army as a recruitment tool than issuing a draft.

*sigh* I don't know about you guys, but FPS like AA don't make me want to join the army.. Nor does Katamari Damacy make me want to roll a giant ball of trash over houses...

Speaking of which.. I need to find something big enough to add to the ball to get up to that point.. *keeps on rolling*

@ Monkeythumbs

"...not to mention sub-prime mortage loans"

Actually, we're sort of hoping you all won't mention those.

There is no doubt that this well-thought tactic, issued by high-ranking govermental officials, and it is not very surprising. The global war on terrorism is running out of soldiers, as US officials have said…

Brainwashing the youth to fight in almost real-life situations which a solider would face if fighting in Iraq for instance, is most definitely a way to recruit more soldiers for the future…

They just don't like it - it's competition..

http://blogs.abcnews.com/theblotter/2007/09/armed-children-.html

Maybe we should be more 'sensitive' to them and have our children quit playing video games.... To make things fair, we should train them with REAL guns. eh?

I posted an argument there - let's see if they don't post it.. :)
Who wants to bet this never makes it to the site?

You all are my witness.. :)

*************************************************

Back in the 1960s, a computer war game was unheard of;

Umm, because personal computers were unheard of in the 60's, lol? *psst* - (In 1966, Ralph Baer resumed work on an initial idea he had in 1951 to make an interactive game on a television set. The Brown Box, the last prototype of seven, was released in May 1972 by Magnavox under the name Odyssey. It was the first home video game console.)

How many people in the 60's did you know had video games? I grew up in the 70's and clearly remember the launch of home Video Game systems like - Atari and such - the very first video game Atari made and packaged with the first systems was called 'combat'.

But - even before I got the Atari - I used to watch war movies on TV all the time, and go outside with my friends to play 'war' with Sticks, or whatever. So it's a pointless argument - 'war' play has been around for a long time, indeed.

And while it's very possible it may 'train youth' - it pales in comparison to the training many 'children' throughout the world get with REAL guns and REAL armies - and then, many times die REAL deaths.

Plus - according to accepted history..

"The earliest known interactive electronic game was created by Thomas T. Goldsmith Jr. and Estle Ray Mann on a cathode ray tube[3] in 1947. The game was a missile simulator inspired by radar displays from World War II. It used analog circuitry, not digital, to control the CRT beam and position a dot on the screen. Screen overlays were used for targets since graphics could not be drawn at the time."

So yea - the very first 'Video Game' was based on War - actually.

@ Brian

It looks like your post has shopwn up, because there's now a voice of reason at the bottom of that article's comments field.

This is exactly the type of blog post on which we as gamers should comment directly - responsibly, of course.

Dagnabbit! I hope their mod approves my comment soon!

I should also like to point out something else that I left out of the previous post as it didn't cross my mind at the time.

Patriotism has been a tool used throughout the centuries to draw in recurits.

But there is another similar tool. A tool that had been used throughout the world in the past to draw in new recruits. And today, though the US doesn't use it heavily, many other countries do use it. And, in a sense, it makes the argument used by the youth group slightly hypocritical.

That other tool... is religion. There are many who have used their religious beliefs to try to draw in new recruits, especially for holy wars, but not always. And, let's face it, Christianity and Muslim religions are far from the only religious groups throughout history to rile up the populace and recruit new soldiers.

Not all individuals within a particular religion are guilty of such acts, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen anyway. "For God and King!", "For God and Country!", "Kill the infidels!". A great many battlecries have religion stamped on them.

So let us not forget all those different tools to encourage recruitment into the military.

Nightwng2000
NW2K software

@ChowX:

"An Islamic youth complaining about brain-washing and and desensitization… I wonder if this guy has a sense of humor because that’s pretty funny."

Why? Because you assume HE is desensitized and brainwashed?

"This poor idiot probably thinks we’re all flag waving psychopaths with guns… Which is pretty ironic if you ask me."

Don't you see that, in one sentence, you accuse someone of stereotyping americans and find it ironic because you have assumed he falls in your stereotyped category of 'poor idiot' and 'brainwashed' only because the article says he's Islamic.

I accuse AA of being bargain bin medeocraty(spll?) and thats about it.

@Arion

Of course. He does seem like the type to ignore that Sonic is a Japanese, not American, creation

Sims 2 desensitized me to gardening. The other day I was able to watch the Home and Gardening channel without crying.

“Interestingly the logo of the Monster Inc company has one eye, just like the eye used on the American dollar bill that has come to be known as the all-seeing eye”

They need to get with the times. Like, Lord of the Rings? THE EYE OF SAURON!? Maybe those movies are banned in some places over there...

Normally, I wouldn't bother posting about crap like THIS. However, as a Palestinian muslim myself, I've pretty much run out of patience for idiotic drivel like this.

To assume that the U.S. needs AA to recruit potential soldiers is ridiculous. Seriously, how STUPID does that sound? I sincerely hope that "Empowered Muslim Youth" think this article over again.

This is HARDLY groundbreaking and all in all, a ridiculous shot at the U.S. that honestly helps no one.

As a Muslim who has been playing video games since I can remember, I must say this article is just dumb. America's Army, while a bad game and a bad recruitment tool, is far from brainwashing. If anything, I've heard more people talk about how blatant of a recruitment tool it is and how obvious it is that the conditions in America's Army are nothing like the actual military. While a lot of its makers' actions is questionable like making everyone part of the American army in multiplayer, it's no where near brainwashing. At the same time, I don't think video games coming out from other nations where the player fights as part of that nation's army (like playing part of the Palestinian militia) is any different from Americans playing as part of the American army in video games. And unless you condemn both, you shouldn't condemn either. Personally, I don't think you should be condemning any of it since in the end, it is just a game though I've always been more partial to games such as Civ and Age of Empires (yes I know, completely different genre) that explore several cultures with information on both cultures.

On a different note, to everyone who seems to imply that all Muslims are brainwashed or that any Muslim who accuses someone else as being brainwashed is just being hypocritical, please realize that there are plenty of Muslims who do in fact like to think and don't believe everything Western is evil. Looking at the Muslim world by just looking at those who preach against Americans is like judging all Americans through the actions of the Bush Administration. As a Muslim American who often visits Muslim nations, I can say that we are not all like that and in general both Westerners and those in Muslim countries too often see only the xenophobic sides without looking at the more moderate populace.

Ok, to whoever mentioned sub-prime mortgage loans:
1. They only affect 100 Thousand people out of 20 Million with mortgage loans. These people made an idiotic decision and are paying for it, and i'll be fucked if I pay to help them out.

@BlackIce
The moral high ground is a lot of fun, ain't it?

@Saladin
An excellent point

@Inner Glow
The only muslim nation I was ever welcomed in was Qatar. Many Muslim nations are brainwashed, and that's a shame. Many of the nations are, for the greatest part, xenophobic. But then again, many Muslim nations are a hundred years behind the western world.

Also I just read your comment Inner Glow and I can;t help but think you gave us a good perception of a Muslim Gamer, they don't all think that Western ideas are evil, also Videogames came from America too,

Also thank you for letting us know that there are many Muslim Gamers and Muslim people in general who like to think for themselves and don't always believe in what those extremists say.

Each Gamer from each culture has something to say,

Like myself being an Aussie Gamer, I have less power to do anything about the AO rating issue (R18+ rating in Australia) all because it is all governed by the Australian States and Federal Attorney Generals but I always stand up and fight when my own government tries to censor the internet....

I feel that Videogames are sometimes being bashed and negatively portrayed in many parts of the world...not just in the western nations...

(except for Japan of course who accepts Videogames as part of their culture and also they have the Hentai games)

These visual games are a perfect opportunity to psychologically prepare and even mentally train children to fight in battle…

There is no doubt that this well-thought tactic, issued by high-ranking govermental officials, and it is not very surprising.

So this blog implies that the increase in war games is a well thought out tactic by the American government. In other words, the government is dictating what games are popular?

Right. Nobody who understand the western world would make a ridiculous connection like that. The government doesn't dictate our opinions to us.

...Even though sometimes they try.

AA is not for desensitizing and brainwashing soldiers; that's what boot camp is for.

Personally, I think that if a game has a firearm based combat system, that if you're shooting at another humanoid or bi-pedal alien creature, that game should be Mature. This game being rated T is kind of dumb, I mean, how exactly can a true-to-life-warmachine-brainwashing-tool be rated T by the ESRB? That means that the system is busted (perhaps) or that the game isn't anything like a war simulator (bingo.)

I think he's going overboard with the "AA BRAINWASHES PEOPLE CRAP". However, I definitely hate the America's Army game's, mostly because they're very blatant recruitment tools. Honestly, I hate all of the bullshit propaganda used in this "war on terror".

Ah, America's Army, the controversy that never dies.

I agree with nightwng2000, the game never bothered me. It's not brainwashing, it's just a new type of recruitment ad. Sure, it doesn't show the reality of war. So what? Do those 15 second TV commercials show the reality of war either? Do posters show the reality of war? Does any single recruitment tool used by any nation on the planet show the realties of war? No. So why only condemn America's Army?

Basically, the way I see it, someone in the US military realized that people, especially young adults, aren't watching TV as much, but are playing more and more video games. So he/she figured TV ads would become less and less effective, and that the army needed something else to reach young adults. Rather than try to insert ads into games, why not make a free game that is itself an ad? People love games, and they love things that are free.

But no one is going to play America's Army and suddenly join the military thinking that's exactly what it's like, any more than someone is going to watch some TV ad with a guy climbing a mountain and fighting some beast, and then rush out and join the Marines thinking that's exactly what it is like.

And as for the fact that you only play as the US in the multiplayer... I have to say one huge DUH to that. Keep in mind, this is a game made by the US military, do you think they are going to make a game where you can play as terrorists and kill US soldiers? Great recruitment tool there.

@Chalts

Eh, I understand anti-Us sentiment, especially anti-US military sentiment, may have something to with the dislike for America's Army I see in some places. I still find some of the hypocrasy I see from gamers annoying though.

I mean, when someone like Jack Thompson attacks video games for brainwashing people, and says that they have horrible effects on young minds, etc, etc, video gamers rush to the defense of the industry.

"Video games don't brainwash people. They can't train people to kill. They don't affect people any more than any other form of media. You're just blindly attacking a new form of media because it's new and you don't understand it."

And yet, with America's Army, when various critics start attacking it, I see gamers who have made many statements like the above start to AGREE with the critics. Saying things like that America's Army should never have been made, or that it's somehow worse than any other recruitment tool because it's a video game.

It makes me wonder. Are people completely and utterly unaware of all the different tools the US army uses to try and recruit people? Or do they really think a TV spot or a poster shows the "realties of war" any more than America's Army?

Or is all that talk about video games not being worse or more influential than other mediums just talk, used to defend the industry when a game one likes is attacked, but not something many gamers really believe?

sure it's okay if they have twelve year olds shoot AK's at U.S. soldiers but when we use a game to simulate shooting them it's called "violence"

@ Austin Lewis: The sub-prime mortage loan crisis affects more than just your fellow countrymen my friend - in fact it was the chief contributing to the run on the British bank Northern Rock. It's their own fault for having such a reckless business plan IMHO, but the point I was making is that America's economic misfortune is quickly being exported across the globe due the very nature of the way in which the world money markets operate.

Either way, it was a comment meant in jest; I might equally have said "war".

@Arion

“A friendly monster, Sully, is at the top, while a sneaky monster with bad intentions is in second place. This league can symbolise the current oil league, where countries are the top distributors and those who are in second try their best to be on top, even if it means breaking all work ethics”

Hey, look! Capitalism! Oh noes! I think the fact that he says "This league can symbolise" rather than "This league symbolises" shows that he realizes that he is grasping at straws. Saying it in a passive way such as this doesn't really enforce the idea that he's confident about drawing such conclusions.

When I played AA I had a really bad tendency to blind, injure, or incap my teammates with poorly-tossed grenades. I always felt very bad about this. With the Honor system the game does a good job of trying to make you pay close attention to friendly-fire (even though the models are VERY difficult to tell apart at a distance), and there are MILES servers where you play as if it was a training exercise as opposed to true warfare.

At least the game does not encourage you to "martyr" yourself as a game would if it was developed by an islamic paramilitary group.

Count me down as one of the people who thinks this is one of the best things the military has ever spent $0.88 cents of my tax money on. It's a quality game with an eye towards realistic simulation of squad-based combat that you don't find in many other FPS games. I don't know a single person who's played it that became convinced they should go join the army, although it sure as hell convinced me that I would be a danger to my fellow soldiers if they allowed me to carry flashbangs or grenades.

I can safely say that after completing Call of Duty 4 on veteran, I have no intentions of joining any military whatsoever.

The owners of the blog updated that post with an apology, good for them, not many people can admit when they are wrong. This Muslim blog doesn't look that bad, just ignorance on their side about this specific topic. And with our responses we've shown them a thing or two!

"UPDATE: We appreciate your comments voicing your opinion. However unintentional, we admit that this article was unfair by subjecting only one side of the story. The author understands the counter-criticism of gamers and acknowledges that those influenced by violent games as portrayed in the article below form only a small percentage of the gaming population.

EMY is also aware of studies conducted by the US secret service and the US department of education concerning the influence of violent games, movies and books on children, a copy of which can be obtained here.

Once again, EMY apologises for overreaction on the authors’ part and thanks you for helping us improve future content."

Yeah, they're way off cause the US isn't some ultra-violent, war-first ask-later nation, right? RIGHT?!

They overreached, to be sure, but EMY doesn't come off as shrill, just a group of people who have been, to be honest, subjugated esp. after 9/11, and they're extra-sensitive to things that could lead to further ostracism and persecution. I think if many of us were in their situation we'd be as cautious.

They're not like the political point-scoring legislators reaching for an easy cause to get behind, some may be genuinely fearful that people REALLY want to kill Muslims here in the good ole US of A.

I agree with the previous post.

-Lance corporal (Sargent, second class) MP. In reserve.

@ NorthernPeninsula and Austin Lewis

We're forgetting; the average HUMAN BEING is stuck up, too easy to manipulate and just plain stupid. Why else would we have islamic fundamentalists, christian fundamentalists, and gang members?