What is a "Murder Simulator," Exactly?

February 17, 2008 -
Given Jack Thompson's current screeching that the NIU rampage killer "trained" on violent video games, a recent article on Gaming Steve seems quite timely.

Author Robert Gauss begins by describing his expertise:
I’ve been working with simulator programs for the US Army for about six years now, which I believe makes me an expert on exactly what a simulator is, what a simulation does, and what the goals of these simulators [are]...

Gauss specifically addresses the Grand Theft Auto series, but his points apply to aspects of other controversial games as well:
"Simulators" are devices used to mimic the actions and functions of a real thing, a real situation, or both... and usually involves some sort of realistic motion...

How well does GTA simulate murder? Just even a cursory look can see how GTA fails this test: Everything is presented via a 3rd person view... weapons auto-load and auto-aim... computer people mostly walk and drive around aimlessly and helplessly... computer people don't... act in a realistic manner when attacked... bodies disappear and respawn — hardly like murder if they keep coming back to life

Our "gang games" mentioned above do not even represent murder, but rather a cartoony environment... It’s not just unfair to call Grand Theft Auto a “murder simulator," it is laughably incorrect...

Comments

replay

CSI is the worst offender when it comes to desensitising kids to murder, but I've never heard the media or any fanatical lawyers complain about it.

Re: What is a "Murder Simulator," Exactly?

All jurisdictions, ancient and modern, consider it a most serious crime and therefore impose severe penalty on its commission.

ahhh the sound of common sence
its soo soothing

Preaching to the choir.

Just like in Fox News: ignorance = bliss for many of an American citizen. http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/14/books/14dumb.html
This article justifies my statement, oy.

Great insight, a shame no one will listen to what is being said
[glares at fox news]

Somebody should tell Mr. Gauss to expect a personal email from Jack telling him how he's wrong and Jack's right. Never mind the fact that Gauss has actually worked on simulator programs and Jack never has in his life. :P

why can't this guy be on fox? oh yeah.... :'(

Jack claiming he's an "industry schill" in 3....2.....1.....

@ Tye The Czar

I didn't know the answer to that question either, but I still knew that Europe was a continent, not a country, and that Hungary is a country.

@ Black Manta: "Never mind the fact that Gauss has actually worked on simulator programs and Jack never has in his life. :P"

Is there any reason to believe that Jack has any actual experience with the games that he demonizes?

Of course he has experience. He's set up those 'stings' of his to demonstrate how corrupt the video game industry is by getting his son to buy the games. That's just his publicity stunt to be getting those games into his house because he's actually addicted to the murder simulatorz!

Johnny Bruce Thompson lives in his own delusional world, chasing massacres since that's about all he's got going for him.

I agree 100%

@ Thomas P.

That was one of the funniest videos I ever saw and the question was a piece of cake, wanna know why?

I'm half-hungarian. Even still, it was so pathetic it was funny.

As for this article:

The fact that GTA can't even be considered a simulation, let alone a simulator, should make people (JT) think twice about using the phrase again. Then again, lots of other articles as well as common sense should have done that already too. I also expect a spam message from JT to hit their comments section as well, oh well, it might even be as funny as the video.

Now Doom on the other hand, that is a realistic murder sim.

I laugh when I hear its a murder simulator. GTA is arcade like. When you die you come back no matter how horrible they way you died is. Also no matter how many people you kill you get off with only 100 dollars taken away. Plus you can withstand a lot of bullets without armor on.

hahah genius article! i love it!

@ Hollyowoodbob

Actually, he does. There have been a few news programs where he's seen playing GTA Vice City and such. But of course with Jack being Jack, his experience gets filtered through his prejudiced worldview and he only sees what he wants. :P

hardly like murder if they keep coming back to life
That reminds me of one of my favorite moments in GTA3. I was doing a Kill Frenzy, shooting down gang members. I needed one last kill, but time was running out and there were no gang members to be seen... well, none that were standing. However, the paramedics showed up and revived one of the ones I had just killed, so I killed the poor guy a second time, winning the Kill Frenzy at the last second.
... So realistic.

@Black Manta

Yeah, dude. Jack said he played one of the GTA games for about 10 minutes. TEN MINUTES. On a game that takes hours to complete.

Anyway, Jack really needs to read Gauss' article. Of course...

"However, all of the games that have kill-or-be-killed type plots or actions are rated "M" for Mature by the ESRB and intended for ages 17+. These are games which aren’t made for children or marketed for children."

Tell that to Jack. Especially that last part.

"Ultimately, it is the job of parents to watch, monitor, and participate in what their kids see and play"

Someone had said something similar, and Jack butted in with, "Tell that to the families of the dead people!"

Anyhow, Jack, if you're reading this, please read Gauss' article and seriously think about all that. Thank you.

Take this article to Capital Hill.

Stand on a soap box and read it out loud through a megaphone.

Maybe then Congress will listen.

All a murder sim needs is a simi realistic environment and humans killing humans from there the details of the game stack realism to the point its realistic.

With hat said...so what if they are vague to realistic murder sims so the fck what?
We have books that teach rape, murder and stealing we have TV shows saying these things are ok yet some people forget its fiction something thos with free will enjoy, to remove it in fear of that will only crate a fascist society.

I don't think,even if murder simulators did exist, that gamers would even touch them. TO be realistic there would have to be no respawns, which means if GTA were a murder simulator, after a certain amount of time there would be no police officers and no other characters left other than the player. Or with Counter Strike, when you die in game, you're done. The game gets erased from your PC and it invalidates your copy meaning you can never player on that copy again. And then it woudl log your IP address so even getting a new copy won't help.

SO really ,this guy found two gaping holes in that logic.

I think "murder simulators" are more like those games you get from the army.

"laughably incorrect…" that sums up JT pretty well

Someone should email this to Jack.

@kobra

your right on the spot, someone should email this to him, and "if" JT is here reading this, he should re-think his theory.

@ Gabriel

"Anyway, Jack really needs to read Gauss’ article."

*laughs*

Ha ha... hoo... Jack Thompson reading... that's funny.

I can read; I just choose not to.

Also, s/read/think for myself/

@Jack Thompson:

Either you're a really good impersonator or you just seriously shot yourself in the foot.

Jack has lot's of experience with GTA. He picked up the controller and went out and killed the first cop he saw. Then he proceeded to kill an old lady and a hooker. He knows all about the game.

Wallo, you forget that he first used the hooker's services in his car, and then killed her for a refund.

Oh shi- LOGIC?! I didn't know that existed...

Seriously though, GTA is far from a "simulator". Come on, punishment for wasting 100 virtual people? $100 bribe and all my weapons taken away.

And I wish we had hospitals and medical personnel like they do in GTA. They can revive ANYONE from death! Blew some one up with a rocket launcher? They'll revive them. Get run over by a car and riddled with bullets? No problem, the local hospital will fix you up back to normal!

Have the law on your tail? No problem, steal a car and respray it. Even if the police SEES you do it...it doesn't matter! The law will forget you even existed!

Besides, in real life...who the hell can get on a long enough killing rampage to survive the Police, SWAT, FBI and the Army.

woah- its not bullshit. i didn't know that existed.

It'd be funny if JT was a closet gamer...

The problem with this defence: what happens when games eventually become so life-like, they are far more like simulators than they are currently? Suggesting that they aren't realistic enough will become a very flawed argument...

But if we're using realism as an argument, surely JT should be going after people who attend paintball and airsoft events...?

Jesus Christ

FINALLY!!!

It's about time I found someoen who agrees with the research I myself have done about the games
 
Forgot your password?
Username :
Password :

Shout box

You're not permitted to post shouts.
MaskedPixelantehttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oDPCmmZifE8 John Oliver exposes Miss America.09/22/2014 - 9:00am
james_fudgeI reiterate now - not one email to-date.09/22/2014 - 8:37am
james_fudgeAnd this: https://archive.today/uIjwE09/22/2014 - 8:37am
james_fudgeLet me put this here: https://archive.today/hbtQJ09/22/2014 - 8:35am
InfophileRelevant to this site: http://nielsenhayden.com/makinglight/archives/015984.html#015984 - Apparently allowing comments to be downvoted leads to worse behaviour09/22/2014 - 6:18am
Andrew EisenMP - I love that game but damn my squadmates are bozos.09/21/2014 - 10:05pm
MaskedPixelanteSWAT teams should be banned until they; 1. Learn not to walk into enemy fire, 2. Learn to throw the flashbang INTO the doorway, not the frame and 3. Stop complaining that I'm in their way.09/21/2014 - 9:53pm
Craig R.I'm getting of the opinion that SWAT teams nationwide should be banned. This probably isn't even the most absurd situation in which they've been used.09/21/2014 - 9:26pm
Andrew EisenAnd, predictably, it encouraged more parody accounts, having the exact opposite effect than what was intended.09/21/2014 - 7:07pm
E. Zachary KnightThis is called a police state people. When public officials can send SWAT raids after anyone for any offense, we are no longer free.09/21/2014 - 6:41pm
E. Zachary KnightJudge rules SWAT raid tageting parody Twitter account was justified. http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/19/illinois-judge-swat-raid-parody-twitter-peoria-mayor09/21/2014 - 6:41pm
MechaTama31quik: But even if it did break, at worst it is only as bad as the powder. Even that is assuming that it is dangerous through skin contact, which is not a given if its delivery vehicle is a syringe.09/21/2014 - 4:30pm
MaskedPixelantehttp://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2014/09/20/isis-uses-gta-5-in-new-teen-recruitment-video/09/21/2014 - 4:25pm
quiknkoldSyringes can break. And in a transcontinental delivery, the glass could've broken when crushed. I work in a mail center. Shit like this is super serious09/21/2014 - 3:25pm
E. Zachary KnightIt doesn't matter what is inside the needle. As long as it requires him to take the step of purposefully injecting himself, the threat of the substance is as close to zero as you can get.09/21/2014 - 1:27pm
quiknkoldEzach: I'm not talking about the needle. I'm talking about what's inside. Geeze. Depending on what it is, the sender could be guilty of bioterrorism.09/21/2014 - 12:51pm
E. Zachary Knightquiknkold, No. That syringe is not worse than white powder or a bomb. The syringe requires the recipient to actually inject themselves. Not true for other mail threats.09/21/2014 - 12:49pm
Andrew EisenThe closest to a threat I ever received was a handwritten note slipped under my door that read "I KNOW it was you." Still no idea what that was about. I think the author must have got the wrong apartment.09/21/2014 - 12:28pm
InfophileThat's what they call it? I always called it hydroxic acid...09/21/2014 - 11:57am
MaskedPixelanteProbably dihydrogen monoxide, the most dangerous substance in the universe.09/21/2014 - 10:14am
 

Be Heard - Contact Your Politician