What is a "Murder Simulator," Exactly?
What is a "Murder Simulator," Exactly?
February 17, 2008
Given Jack Thompson's current screeching that the NIU rampage killer "trained" on violent video games, a recent article on Gaming Steve seems quite timely.Author Robert Gauss begins by describing his expertise:
I’ve been working with simulator programs for the US Army for about six years now, which I believe makes me an expert on exactly what a simulator is, what a simulation does, and what the goals of these simulators [are]...
Gauss specifically addresses the Grand Theft Auto series, but his points apply to aspects of other controversial games as well:
"Simulators" are devices used to mimic the actions and functions of a real thing, a real situation, or both... and usually involves some sort of realistic motion...
How well does GTA simulate murder? Just even a cursory look can see how GTA fails this test: Everything is presented via a 3rd person view... weapons auto-load and auto-aim... computer people mostly walk and drive around aimlessly and helplessly... computer people don't... act in a realistic manner when attacked... bodies disappear and respawn — hardly like murder if they keep coming back to life
Our "gang games" mentioned above do not even represent murder, but rather a cartoony environment... It’s not just unfair to call Grand Theft Auto a “murder simulator," it is laughably incorrect...
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Posted 11/07/09 at 04:27pm
ZippyDSMlee: man I got alot of junk and dup files too >< god I need orginization...and no not the knee capping media mafia kind :P
ZippyDSMlee: man I got alot of junk and dup files too >< god I need orginization...and no not the knee capping media mafia kind :P
Posted 11/07/09 at 04:26pm
ZippyDSMlee: replaced :P
ZippyDSMlee: replaced :P
Posted 11/07/09 at 04:23pm
ZippyDSMlee: beemoh:hey its like 60GB porn,400GB anime 100GB games and crap I have took from all my DVDs, I hate waiting on dvds to install stuff..... oh and 40GB of my porn was in the found.000 folder...mostly corrupted.... least I got names of wut needs to be repa
ZippyDSMlee: beemoh:hey its like 60GB porn,400GB anime 100GB games and crap I have took from all my DVDs, I hate waiting on dvds to install stuff..... oh and 40GB of my porn was in the found.000 folder...mostly corrupted.... least I got names of wut needs to be repa
Posted 11/07/09 at 04:18pm
beemoh: @Zip: ...and you'd have to spend all that time re-downloading that porn?
beemoh: @Zip: ...and you'd have to spend all that time re-downloading that porn?
Posted 11/07/09 at 03:34pm
ZippyDSMlee: ggrrrrr......vista lost one of my hard drives and I had a heart attack thinking I lost 1TB of data....
ZippyDSMlee: ggrrrrr......vista lost one of my hard drives and I had a heart attack thinking I lost 1TB of data....
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:58am
JDKJ: Which could be explained by both (a) and (b).
JDKJ: Which could be explained by both (a) and (b).
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:56am
Austin_Lewis: JDKJ: You forgot C) the fact that, for some reason, every time he did something that would suggest he shouldn't be in the military, let alone an officer, higher ups ignored it or let it slide.
Austin_Lewis: JDKJ: You forgot C) the fact that, for some reason, every time he did something that would suggest he shouldn't be in the military, let alone an officer, higher ups ignored it or let it slide.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:51am
JDKJ: Part of the problem is, I believe, that (a) the Army had a lot of time and money already invested in him and which they were unwilling to simply write-off and (b) an increasing need for the type of skills and services he provided.
JDKJ: Part of the problem is, I believe, that (a) the Army had a lot of time and money already invested in him and which they were unwilling to simply write-off and (b) an increasing need for the type of skills and services he provided.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:48am
JDKJ: And that even if he was begging not to get cut loose, he was apparently a real good candidate for being cut loose, anyway.
JDKJ: And that even if he was begging not to get cut loose, he was apparently a real good candidate for being cut loose, anyway.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:11am
JDKJ: @chada: And while Kennedy once noted that there's usually more than enough blame for everyone to get a slice, the possibility that the Army was unwilling to cut loose someone who was asking to get cut loose could be a factor.
JDKJ: @chada: And while Kennedy once noted that there's usually more than enough blame for everyone to get a slice, the possibility that the Army was unwilling to cut loose someone who was asking to get cut loose could be a factor.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:07am
ZippyDSMlee: *noms on his feet*..nomnomnomnom*droooll* ...wuuutttttt uuu looking at?
ZippyDSMlee: *noms on his feet*..nomnomnomnom*droooll* ...wuuutttttt uuu looking at?
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:05am
JDKJ: I'm no psychologist, but I'm told that crazy people have a tendency to do crazy things.
JDKJ: I'm no psychologist, but I'm told that crazy people have a tendency to do crazy things.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:03am
chadachada321: Whoops, was out of the convo for awhile. I do wonder what type of ammo he used etc, but the real issue is WHY he did it, not HOW
chadachada321: Whoops, was out of the convo for awhile. I do wonder what type of ammo he used etc, but the real issue is WHY he did it, not HOW
Posted 11/07/09 at 09:56am
JDKJ: But if it turns out that they actually did, they'll have Hell to pay.
JDKJ: But if it turns out that they actually did, they'll have Hell to pay.
Posted 11/07/09 at 09:45am
JDKJ: And I'd tend to rule out the possibilty of FN Herstal supplying restricted ammunition to someone merely because they're ordering it from a military base.
JDKJ: And I'd tend to rule out the possibilty of FN Herstal supplying restricted ammunition to someone merely because they're ordering it from a military base.
Posted 11/07/09 at 09:37am
JDKJ: I know you don't leave your gated community and get around much in dark alleys, so you may be surprised to learn that there's this thing called "the black market" where, if you've got enough money, ain't too much of anything which can't be bought.
JDKJ: I know you don't leave your gated community and get around much in dark alleys, so you may be surprised to learn that there's this thing called "the black market" where, if you've got enough money, ain't too much of anything which can't be bought.
Posted 11/07/09 at 09:36am
Austin_Lewis: Or, maybe he or someone else at the base ordered the SS190 from FN Herstal.
Austin_Lewis: Or, maybe he or someone else at the base ordered the SS190 from FN Herstal.
Posted 11/07/09 at 09:32am
Austin_Lewis: the hands of private owners. They run about 300 dollars minimum for a box of 50, and boxes of AP 5.7 are extremely scarce, mainly residing in the hands of Class III stores or individuals who for one reason or another got a demo box of it.
Austin_Lewis: the hands of private owners. They run about 300 dollars minimum for a box of 50, and boxes of AP 5.7 are extremely scarce, mainly residing in the hands of Class III stores or individuals who for one reason or another got a demo box of it.
Posted 11/07/09 at 09:30am
Austin_Lewis: There are other firearms that fire the 5.7. However, I too would like to know where he got the ammo and what kind was used. Maybe Hasan, planning not to live through this, went out and bought one the boxes of SS190 that are floating around in
Austin_Lewis: There are other firearms that fire the 5.7. However, I too would like to know where he got the ammo and what kind was used. Maybe Hasan, planning not to live through this, went out and bought one the boxes of SS190 that are floating around in
Posted 11/07/09 at 08:44am
JDKJ: And it isn't yet clear what type of ammunition Hasan used. It's strange that he purchased a gun but didn't purchase ammunition for it at the same place and time. Especially because the calibre required is peculiar to the actual gun.
JDKJ: And it isn't yet clear what type of ammunition Hasan used. It's strange that he purchased a gun but didn't purchase ammunition for it at the same place and time. Especially because the calibre required is peculiar to the actual gun.
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Comments
its soo soothing
This article justifies my statement, oy.
[glares at fox news]
I didn't know the answer to that question either, but I still knew that Europe was a continent, not a country, and that Hungary is a country.
Is there any reason to believe that Jack has any actual experience with the games that he demonizes?
That was one of the funniest videos I ever saw and the question was a piece of cake, wanna know why?
I'm half-hungarian. Even still, it was so pathetic it was funny.
As for this article:
The fact that GTA can't even be considered a simulation, let alone a simulator, should make people (JT) think twice about using the phrase again. Then again, lots of other articles as well as common sense should have done that already too. I also expect a spam message from JT to hit their comments section as well, oh well, it might even be as funny as the video.
Actually, he does. There have been a few news programs where he's seen playing GTA Vice City and such. But of course with Jack being Jack, his experience gets filtered through his prejudiced worldview and he only sees what he wants. :P
That reminds me of one of my favorite moments in GTA3. I was doing a Kill Frenzy, shooting down gang members. I needed one last kill, but time was running out and there were no gang members to be seen... well, none that were standing. However, the paramedics showed up and revived one of the ones I had just killed, so I killed the poor guy a second time, winning the Kill Frenzy at the last second.
... So realistic.
Yeah, dude. Jack said he played one of the GTA games for about 10 minutes. TEN MINUTES. On a game that takes hours to complete.
Anyway, Jack really needs to read Gauss' article. Of course...
"However, all of the games that have kill-or-be-killed type plots or actions are rated "M" for Mature by the ESRB and intended for ages 17+. These are games which aren’t made for children or marketed for children."
Tell that to Jack. Especially that last part.
"Ultimately, it is the job of parents to watch, monitor, and participate in what their kids see and play"
Someone had said something similar, and Jack butted in with, "Tell that to the families of the dead people!"
Anyhow, Jack, if you're reading this, please read Gauss' article and seriously think about all that. Thank you.
Stand on a soap box and read it out loud through a megaphone.
Maybe then Congress will listen.
With hat said...so what if they are vague to realistic murder sims so the fck what?
We have books that teach rape, murder and stealing we have TV shows saying these things are ok yet some people forget its fiction something thos with free will enjoy, to remove it in fear of that will only crate a fascist society.
SO really ,this guy found two gaping holes in that logic.
your right on the spot, someone should email this to him, and "if" JT is here reading this, he should re-think his theory.
"Anyway, Jack really needs to read Gauss’ article."
*laughs*
Ha ha... hoo... Jack Thompson reading... that's funny.
Also, s/read/think for myself/
Either you're a really good impersonator or you just seriously shot yourself in the foot.
Seriously though, GTA is far from a "simulator". Come on, punishment for wasting 100 virtual people? $100 bribe and all my weapons taken away.
And I wish we had hospitals and medical personnel like they do in GTA. They can revive ANYONE from death! Blew some one up with a rocket launcher? They'll revive them. Get run over by a car and riddled with bullets? No problem, the local hospital will fix you up back to normal!
Have the law on your tail? No problem, steal a car and respray it. Even if the police SEES you do it...it doesn't matter! The law will forget you even existed!
Besides, in real life...who the hell can get on a long enough killing rampage to survive the Police, SWAT, FBI and the Army.
But if we're using realism as an argument, surely JT should be going after people who attend paintball and airsoft events...?
FINALLY!!!
All jurisdictions, ancient and modern, consider it a most serious crime and therefore impose severe penalty on its commission.
CSI is the worst offender when it comes to desensitising kids to murder, but I've never heard the media or any fanatical lawyers complain about it.