Hot Coffee Rewind: Famed Dutch Modder Talks to EGM

Hot Coffee Rewind: Famed Dutch Modder Talks to EGM

March 3, 2008
Aside from the April Fool's jokes (our fave: Lego Halo), the latest issue of Electronic Gaming Monthly offers a massive - and genuine - preview of Grand Theft Auto IV. The highly-anticipated game, of course, is due to launch on April 29th.

While we don't believe the GTA feature is officially available online, page scans have been posted here and there, inlcuding EGM's interview with Patrick Wildenborg, the Dutch modder who discovered the hidden sex animations which blew the lid off the 2005 Hot Coffee scandal.

When Hot Coffee broke, of course, it was GamePolitics which provided a platform for PatrickW to get his story out, even as some creepy Take Two and Rockstar execs were trying to blame the GTA mod community for creating the racy content. From the EGM interview:
It's a strange feeling to find e-mails from all the major news companies in your mail box... luckily it didn't have any lasting negative effect... We [in the modding community] never anticipated how this thing was going to be blown out of proportion by the mainstream media and the politicians...

I'm still proud of finding and uncovering the [Hot Coffee] scenes - because of all the work and research it took... When I look back at it, I think [Rockstar] should have reacted differently, but I don't hold a grudge at all.

Patrick is still active in the GTA mod community, but told EGM he doesn't expect to find anything similar in Grand Theft Auto IV.
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Comments

R* have officially admitted their guilt over leaving the content on the disc already not long after it happened. The case is only being mentioned because GTA4 is about 2 months away now.
Anyone who still blames modders for Hot Coffee is a nutcase.
And thats why Rockstar is a joke
[...] Filed under: Culture, Sony PlayStation 3, Microsoft Xbox 360 [...]
People are STILL going on about this shit? How old is the damn game? About 3-4 years old? Modifications are not the work of the companies. I seriously doubt that the bastard is right about the content already being on the disc. Modders can say anything. Skeptics will say, "Everything looks professionally done, it must have been the work of Rockstar." Bullshit. I've seen models and re-textures for The Elder Scrolls IV:Oblivion, and they look just like they were places into the game. There are many nude character textures out there, so should I believe that Rockstar actually tried to get around the ESRB? I really don't. What would they gain from doing so?
@Soroki

When you can access the Hot Coffee scenes on a PS2 just by using a Gameshark/Action Replay, then its something that's included on the disk. I can't believe skeptics of that still exist.
Looking back at that whole fiasco, it seems almost surreal how overblown the whole issue was.
The Hot Coffee scenes were humorous (mostly due to CJ still being fully clothed the whole time) and not even the least bit erotic. To a kid it's like taking two G.I. Joe's and stacking them on top of each other (come on, you all did it >_>)
I know this is old with a captal O but at least I am happy that a smart gamer found that than a nutjob like Jack Thompson (he would have faked it like those Fake Bully "Scans"), Just imagine how bad it got if that happend...
@Soroki:

Actually, no one is "still going on about this shit." EGM just interviewed him as part of a mini retrospective on the past GTA games and controversies for their GTA4 main cover story.

Oh, and the content was on the disk. I managed to access the content in the PS2 version by using a Gameshark and a hacked save file.
Let's not forget that the many people who have a puritanical attitude of the topic of human sexuality are what fueled this incident. Take away that aspect, and this thing would not have acquired the attention of knuckleheads like Leland Yee and such.
Look, if you have to actually "hack" the game in order to see this content then you are kinda opening yourself up to it, aren't you?

This was only a problem in the US because of your backwards nudity laws. In the UK there was no scandal over hot coffee for two reasons:

1 - The game was already rated 18 because it lets you kill cops.
2 - Even if the game had a 15+ rating, no one would have cared as scenes are pathetic and kids can look at titties in the UK by opening the Sun up to page 3.

The US needs to sort out its laws regarding nudity. They make no sense at all... (i.e. you can have sex 2 years before you can look at a porno! wtf?!)
gs2005 sez:
"Let’s not forget that the many people who have a puritanical attitude of the topic of human sexuality are what fueled this incident."

That's what I can't understand... If those people are so prudish about sex, why are there so MANY of them? :)
So what ever happened between the game and the ESRB over this content. Multiple people have told me that they SAW copies of the game with AO stickers over the M stickers, with store staff saying it was a temporary fix until new copies with actual AO's on it came in.

It's quite a while later now, and i still see M's in the store... Were people lying, or did certain retailers overreact and make up thier own AO's?
@ SeanB

When the hack was found and it was found to actually be Rockstar's fault, the game was reissued an AO rating. Retailers were sent new AO rating labels to place over the M rating. Most retailers recalled the game and sent it back to the publisher.

Once Rockstar actually removed the content from the production disk, the games were sent out with an M rating. Those are the ones you see in stores today. You will be hard pressed to find an original copy of the game.
@SeanB

Rock* released a new version with all the Hot Coffee code completely removed this time and it was given its M rating back.
It's too bad Lego Halo is a hoax.

I'd totally buy that game.
I stand corrected. I thought the mod was for the PC version, because I generally think of mods for PC, not console.
@Dog_Welder

I'd prefer Lego GoW, thank you
I'm not a nutcase. I've seen some pretty sexually explicit mods for games and it was all the work of the modders. That's why I blamed the modders. I've been informed that it was already on the game disc.
[...] EGM interviews Hot Coffee modder after cooling March 03rd, 2008 | Category: Gaming News Filed under: Culture, Sony PlayStation 3, Microsoft Xbox 360 [...]
Lego GoW would be awesome, too, but I think LEGO would frown on the chainsaw bayonet.
@Soroki

Well, screaming at the entitre mod community for something unrelated doesn't really help.
@kurisu7885

Where exactly was I screaming? Generally screaming in text IS WRITTEN LIKE THIS IN ALL CAPS. I have already admitted I was corrected on this matter.
Soroki: for a PS2 game, the content has to already be on the disc. On PC, sure, modders could possibly add content. But it's simply impossible on previous-gen consoles.
@Soroki: In both the PC and the PS2 game, it's been confirmed and reconfirmed that the content was already on the disc. As Timson notes, PS2 disc images cannot be altered to include new content, so the content's existence on the PS2 disc is solid proof.

Before the game went into final production, Rockstar decided not to include the Hot Coffee content in the release build of the game. Rather than removing the content directly (which, in retrospect, would have been a good idea), the programming team flipped a few bits around in the code to prevent the conditions for accessing the content from ever being satisfied if the game were played as intended. For all practical purposes, the content was locked, it would never be seen, and the problem was solved.

However, modders don't just play games through normal means - they use various tools and methods (the details of which I won't go into) to look at how in-game content is encoded, make their own content either by (a) re-arranging existing parts in the game, such as custom levels and gametypes, or (b) writing new objects of their own, such as custom textures, weapons, or items. Patrick happened to be the first modder to notice the Hot Coffee content while examining the game, and as such, is credited with discovering it. Let's be honest - if he didn't find it, someone else would have eventually. Bravo for being #1, though.

So before you fire off accusations that modders make content and lie about its origins, do a little research to understand how things work. Because when you don't know what you're talking about, you just make an ass of yourself.
@Fact Alert

I will state, for the third time, that I have admitted I was wrong and that I have been informed of the truth. I DO understand how modding works, I'm a game designer and programmer myself. I only thought the mod was available for the PC version of the game, because I don't normally equate modding with consoles(which I know can be done, just not easily) Why do you continue to verbally harass me? I'm not "firing off accusations" I simply was missing a few pieces of the matter, a common human mistake.
[...] Via GamePolitics [...]
@Soroki

I don't mod console games for that reason myself, and for risk of voiding the warranty and wrecking the console.

And apologies for that, I didn't see the post.
If there is anything of the sort in GTA4 then 2008 Darwin Award goes to Rockstar.
Re: Hot Coffee Rewind: Famed Dutch Modder Talks to EGM

Hacks do make the life of a game longer. They're good. Hacks are good for gamers and for the companies :)

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GamePolitics ShoutBox

Posted 09/05/08 at 06:11am
Flamespeak: Jade from Beyond Good and Evil is a good one. Too bad it didn't sell too good. Here's to the sequel.
Posted 09/05/08 at 06:10am
Flamespeak: Lara Croft = Sex object, Fat Princess = making fun of overweight women, Cooking Mama = women belong in kitchen.
Posted 09/05/08 at 06:09am
Flamespeak: You can't please feminists with any representation of women in video games, it seems.
Posted 09/05/08 at 05:47am
gamepolitics: he works on his crusade from home. I expect he will be disbarred, but will continue his crusade
Posted 09/05/08 at 05:46am
gamepolitics: I'm surprised people are taking that story so seriously... one of those oddball things. my choice of graphic is my commentary
Posted 09/05/08 at 01:50am
Flamespeak: To be fair, if you dismiss video games as contributors to violence in youth, it is hypocritical to say they cause heroism.
Posted 09/04/08 at 09:21pm
Tarosan: @gamepolitics has he actually lost his job or is on the verge of being disgraced forever?
Posted 09/04/08 at 09:21pm
HalfShadow: If either of you waste good music on him, I swear I will kill you.
Posted 09/04/08 at 09:19pm
Tarosan: I shall blare out "We are Champions" as soon as he gets sacked and post a celebration video on Youtube :P
Posted 09/04/08 at 07:45pm
King of Fiji: @Austin: Go try "I'm Going Slightly Mad" it describes Jack 's mind greatly. xD
Posted 09/04/08 at 07:25pm
Austin_Lewis: @King and Grizzam: I'm going to stand on my mansion's front porch with my Les Paul and Marshall half stack and play both.
Posted 09/04/08 at 07:17pm
ZippyDSMlee: gamepolitics: loseign the bar dose. mostly, hecan still sit in with other lawyers tho..
Posted 09/04/08 at 06:51pm
gamepolitics: He has no job to lose...
Posted 09/04/08 at 06:16pm
King of Fiji: @GRIZZAM PRIME: Instead of the standard "We Are the Champions" might I suggest trying "Hammer to Fall" instead? :D
Posted 09/04/08 at 05:49pm
GRIZZAM PRIME: Jack's disbarment...I already have the giant speakers and the Queen CD rigged up...
Posted 09/04/08 at 04:40pm
Tarosan: I'm hoping Jack loses his job in two weeks... the stupidity in his posts is just well DUMB
Posted 09/04/08 at 03:18pm
ZippyDSMlee: Bannign is stupid,but regulating things for the use by the..er.. "mature" is not so bad.
Posted 09/04/08 at 03:01pm
ZippyDSMlee: SimonBob:and if he was drunk he would be a bad shot, at least at range(8+feet). 20+ proof needs to be reserved for 25ish+ year old while 5-12% beer and wine be approved for 18+.
Posted 09/04/08 at 02:59pm
ZippyDSMlee: SimonBob: why? a 6 pack or 2 would be enough to get anyone drunk, theres no point is banning the harder stuff. sipping the harder stuff in small shot glasses having about. 15oz of it is alot better than drinking 10 12oz cans in a row..... and if he wa
Posted 09/04/08 at 02:53pm
SimonBob: You guys suck at this. The article says Gill drank "2 to 7 drinks a day, including the day of the shooting" and not one of you
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