The thing that really bothers me about this is that the CTA consistently is facing budget cutbacks. Here, they have a clear source of revenue from a big-time developer and they cave to pressure and lost that revenue. Blago, in his infinite wisdom, pressures them in 2004 to cut the ads, but then tells them they aren't going to receive the same amount of state funds. It seems a touch ridiculous.

It should also be mentioned again that Blago spent millions of dollars of taxpayer funds in his ill-advised crusade against games. All during a year of historic shortfalls in the state budget. To think, there was no other suitable alternative last gubernatorial election cycle.

@Visari

If the industry went around suing everyone that talked shit about them, they'd be no better than Jack.

Also, the ad itself is harmless. I mean, come on! It's just 2 people.

I don't know...one time when I was five or so, I saw an advertisement for the movie PREDATOR...and then I saw the actual movie...and now I'm an upstanding citizen who may just have a bright future in illustration...where the hell am I going with this?

oh thats just bull

Yes its the buses that cause all the crime. The game industry really needs to stand up for it's self in these situations.

Again, this continues to make my point, over and over.

THe industry has no BALLS!!!!!!

They'd be suing the shit outta these dirt bags right now if they had any guts.

@ Benji

It's called discrimination technically, but to put more of a point on it, there's also things like "Equal rights under the law" to consider. They won't all games but an r rated movie gets a pass?

BULLSHIT!

I still say the industry should be laying the legal smackdown on there ass.

Are first amendment rights extended to advertising? I am not an expert in US constitutional law but I have my doubts that was the intent of this amendment. The way I see it, if a government is preventing you from your 'expression' then you might have a case. If a private entity (even one frunded by government) refuses to enter into an advertising contract with you, are your rights to expression being trampled upon?

You can always advertise elsewhere.

Now if the government is preventing most or ANY advertising by you, you may have an issue at that point.

I am not sure this is worth pursuing.

GP: I have to disagree. This is the further demonization of games and, by extension, gamers. What's more, the bus companies are not private firms. They are quasi-governmental agencies, propped up in large part by tax dollars.

Finally, NORML Change the Climate successfully sued the MBTA on this very issue in 2003.

[...] wrote an interesting post today onHere’s a quick excerptAs police and city officials in Chicago deal with a rash of recent shooting incidents, the local Fox News affiliate has questioned the posting of ads for Grand Theft Auto IV on buses and buildings of the Chicago Transit Authority (CTA). And, just like that, CTA president Ron Huberman folded on the issue, telling Fox News through a representative that the ads would be removed. It’s not the first time that Chicago’s buses have provided the setting for a GTA controversy. In 2004 Gov. Rod Blagojevich railed against transit ads for GTA San Andreas. Over the years, GTA transit ads have come under fire in other cities as well. In 2006 Boston Mayor Thomas Menino and others forced the Massachusetts Bay Transit Authority (MBTA) to pull ads for GTA Vice City Stories. The transit chief there justified his decision by issuing a policy which equates M-rated games with X-rated movies. GTA bus ads have also come under fire […] [...]

@Sean B

Yeah, this from a person who apparently isn't paying much attention to the fact that the industry has been whopping Censor ass in court for the past 5 years.

Save your self serving rants for the brain dead minions in your church group.

I think that when dennis talked about their first amendment rights it was the right for rockstar/taketwo to come out and odicially say "You people are total dicks & if you don't want our advertising money, we'll spend it somewhere else"

Did they actually enter into a contract to display the advertising or was this a "coming soon to busses everywhere" thing? If they had a contract, then on the surface, chicago would seem to be in breach of it.

@ Mottom

If he is, then he needs to mark it /sarcasam or face my half asleep, exhausted tech support rage

Honestly, this is probably a great move on R*'s part. As has already been stated, censoring a game only gives it free advertising, which generates more interest than a thousand bus ads. GTA4 is a big enough name that everyone probably knows about already, so a bus ad would maybe raise awareness 0.1%. And besides, R* is a big enough name that they don't care about something silly like the CTA.

And besides, as I have often said anyway, Chicago sucks.

Usually my commentary is more in depth than this but I know of no way to say this more simply than the Industry as a whole needs to grow up and grow a pair.

You know, its high tim the video game industry struck back. The ESA, ECA, The publishers, the developers, the consumers stood up to this. This is retarded, in every sense of the word. These people are using their power to squash this becuase they don't like it. If you go after ads becuase of what the products, then go after all of them, and not just videogames!

I wonder if 'Campaign for a Commercial-free Childhood' has anything to do with this. I tell you, You want a commerical-free childhood? Get rid of the TV, the internet and lock yourself up ant home and NEVER LEAVE THE HOUSE AGAIN! NEVER TALK TO ANYONE! DON'T READ ANY BOOKS! THROW THEM OUT! And there you have it. A 'commerical free childhood' and a 'commerical free life.'

Warren Lewis

I think there's something to be said for the industry choosing its battles. If the industry presses the point, then what? It's protesting for its right to advertise for a highly controversial, mature-rated game, on a venue where many minors will be exposed to it? And honestly, 99% of the target demographic probably already knew the game's coming out without any advertising at all. I suspect that ($ saved from not paying for any more CTA ads) + (sales generated from free advertisement over the controversy) > ($ from sales generated by bus ads).
The idealists can say it's unfair, and it is, but the pragmatists can also realize that there's nothing much to gain from pressing the point.

Textbook case of content based discrimination. The game industry really needs to get off its ass and fight this one. Take Two or Rockstar could pretty easily win this kind of case.

I understand the argument about picking your battles but this kind of case could really be a HUGE blow to the "violent video games are evil" crowd.

In order to have this kind of discrimination upheld the CTA would be required to show there is a COMPELLING state interest in this kind of restriction. Which means they'd have to bring in real, honest to God, evidence that violent video games lead to violent behavior.

As we all know the evidence of that is...sketchy...at best. So if Take Two or Rockstar were to fight this we could finally get a court ruling that says something to the effect of:

"The connection between the advertisement or playing of violent video games and violent behavior is simply too tenuous to uphold regulation of the medium. The state has shown no compelling interest in this kind of content based regulation."

It would be a major blow to the regulation supporters. It would create a pretty iron-clad precedent that would stick barring some kind of real evidence that there is a connection between violent behavior and violent video games.

Oh good lord. If they didn't want to advertise anything with depictions of violence, that's fine, but it's f**ked for them to single out video games.

Knowing how slow the transit authority here is, the game will already be out before all of these get removed. And if its any sooner than I'll be pissed because the CTA (and RTA as a whole) is a joke and if this becomes a priority ... I just don't see how Ron Huberman can keep his job.

Thanks, John Bruce.

Excellent work CTA! As you consistently raise fees due to poor budgeting, this was the best time to take a chance at reducing your advertising income.

*Sigh* Yet another part of my hometown, Chicago, that I can't support. Thankfully I can feed the birds at the parks, they're at least neutral on the videogame issue.

fox distorts games again.

one person thinks it should stay and everyone else wants them down? a little bit uneven air time.

that and mentioning a bunch of killings in the city before hand.

EA should have sued Fox over the Mass Effect slander to send a message that this kind of crap is not acceptable. but it is Fox so what do you expect.

I completely agree that CTA has violated R*/Take Two's right to free speech. However, good points have been brought up that such a fight would bring negative focus on Take Two as a company.

I suggest an alternative angle that still proves they've got some cahones on 'em.

Sue CTA for misrepresentation of their product, aka advertising.

Those signs on those buses had to be approved BEFORE the contract for advertising was signed and CTA received funds. What went on the buses was no surprise, it was just Faux News making noise and the city of Chicago bowing down. Make them pay monetarily. Make this kind of action VERY costly to those who do it.

[...] Shameful. After MyFox Chicago ran a little piece questioning why a violent game is being advertised on city buses, the head of the Chicago Transit Authority had the ads removed. There are so many things wrong with this, from ignorance on parade to the violation of free speech as a public authority arbitrarily decides what gets to be advertised and what doesn’t. Earlier they decided that M-rated games were equivalent to X-rated movies. [...]

I doubt ads for R rated movies draw the same kind of ire.

@anyone who will answer

Sorry, aside from the lying fest that was Mass Effect,what else has FOX NEWS said that was false and misleading?I don't watch much(I may occasionally watch with My Dad)but I keep hearing stories about ho they mislead viewers.
Would you give me some examples?

Yep. FOX taught me how to be a good reporter. If someone dissagrees with you, you just make wierd noises and cut them off until they get frustrated and decide to leave, and then when they sue you for slander, you sue them for not agreeing with you, and then you get 6 million dollars in a settlement and start to invite only those who agree with you on to your show, and then, because so many people take the stupid shit you say at face value, you convince the world to turn on itself and elect you president, upon which, you erode people's rights until you trigger a rebelion and are exiled. Yep...I report, you die inside...(END RUN ON SENTENCE)

@ JC Fox didn't have anything to do with the sorry???? Come now you know better than that. Wasn't it on the FOX network??

Not to mention the slanted reporting on the game Mass Effect. I just find it very courious that Fox News or as I like to call them the "Cartoon Network" would rail against so called mature material considering the content that Fox has put on the "Public Airwaves over the years, and the tabloids owned by News Corp and the R movies made and distributed by 20th Century Fox and other studios owned by News Corp. I guess they can only rail against their competitor's smut not their own.

Well for me I need the facts not to told what to think I am more than able to do that for myself.

@ The Edge well you should watch it for a week and see for yourself. Well a major one "The War" but to be fair many lap dogs in the media took part in that one. The echo chamber they call fair and balanced. Isn't there a law regarding truth in advertising. Well I can suggest watch O'Reilly then watch Countdown on MSNBC I think you will get a clear picture on the bias.

/Facepalm

This reminds me of that trainstation in... Boston I beleave that was forced to take down GTA: Vice City ads but was plastered with ads for some brand of hard liqour

Filthy hypocrites.

This goes to show you what kind of crooks we have running this state. It's nothing but freaking Crook County filth that takes kickbacks and subsidies like it's nothing. And you wonder why Chicago has become more costly to live in these days.

[...] Gamepolitics has more here; it is apparently not the first time that this has happened in Illinois, or in any city for that matter. As the site noted, video games need to assert their First Amendment protections and show the government that their actions amount to censorship and should not be tolerated. [...]

@ DarknessDeku

I never said it wouldn't I just meant that if GP started to report on more than just games I would trust it as unbiased... although if he did start to become biased I'm sure we would all crucify him... figurativly speaking.

Lol, there are GTAIV ads all over. Store fronts, billboards, even some building in NY have a giant Niko painted on the side.

So why the buses? It's complete BS if you ask me. I see R rated movies with a lot of violence on bus ads all the time, what makes video games different?

In case you didn't notice, you got dugg via my post at CrunchGear. :)

[...] Link [...]

Get off the "I HATE FOX NEWS" alright? I'm sorry Fox News doesn't express their left wing views like CNN (Communist News Network) or PMSNBC/MSDNC does everyday on their networks.

It's also nice to know that you won't mention the political affliation of the Governor and the Anti-Gun loser Mayor, because both of them are LIBERAL DEMOCRATS! Just maybe if Mayor Daley let law bidding citizen to own a gun since it's stated in the Consitution your city wouldn't be infested with gangs.

@Zone

Apparently you weren't here when they called Mass Effect pronographic or when they won the right to lie and perhaps you haven't noticed their clear as day bias (oh and the reason we aren't bashing the other news networks is because this story comes from fox not the other networks)

And apparently you also weren't here for the HUGE gun-control debates we've had here. Not all of us are anti-gun (like me for example).

But please ranting nonsensical conspiracy theories are great to listen to especially since Jack has apparently left us.

Vdieo game adverts on buses made me kill.

you heard it here first.

*headdesk*

@Zone

You are right Fox News don't express thier left wing views on air, they express their right wing views on air.

*****Off Topic Soap Box Moment*******

So Chicago is the only city with a gang problem and its down to the Mayor's political views; and more guns is going to solve gun crime? And before you decide I am anti-gun I am not, I disagree that more guns is going to make it better, That's like saying to someone with a drug problem take more drugs, or to solve the drug problem legalize drugs, you shifted the problem not solved it; but thats off topic about slanted news coverage and how video games is the cause of society's problems, before that it was TV and movies, Rock music, and way back when in Salem it was witches; but not to mention the problems, of poverty, poor education and lack of economic opportunity as causes .

@John

Just to clarify the pro-gun position is (summed up) that bad guys will always get their guns due to the black market so let regular citizens have concealed carry so they can defend themselves they figure if more citizens (who live in those areas) carry concealed guns muggings and whatnot will decrease since the criminals will now fear the armed victim even more (since there are more of them). It's not the same thing as saying drugs can solve a drug problem, since you can't use illegal drugs to cure addiction.

Perhaps to a point, but the mere fact of more guns isn't going to make things automatically better. I am more of the line of stiffer punishment for gun crime, and the black market for selling guns along the line of drug smuggling after all by the very definition someone buying a black market gun has illegal intent. after all a law abiding citizen would buy their legally. And this idea of muggings going down due to concealed weapons on the surface may at first blush seem logical, how about another perspective, the robber shoots first then rob you? After all why take the chance?? And not to mention the number of high strung people in traffic these days lets add more guns in mix? Plus the problem of children and guns (School shootings) I believe the vast majority got the guns from home not the black market. Also an FBI stat from a few years ago cited that most gun violence in the home wasn't the result from an intruder using a gun on home owner but from someone in the home using it against a family member. Another supply of black market guns were stolen from law abiding citizens. And another thing to ponder say you get a citizen and a bad guy to square off, care to get caught in that cross fire, or worst yet the citizen shoots and kill the wrong person, or in a dark parking garage someone shoots some poor guy trying to find his car after working over time. Or guns in bars? Nothing spells a good time like alcohol and fire arms. I live in an area that has a concealed weapons law but certain places you can not carry it (bars and churches for example), so you leave it in the car?? Car is stolen or broken into another gun in the hands of a criminal.

I just pointed of just a few situations where good intentions can lead to adverse out comes; so more guns don't make you safer the same as saying citizens can't get guns in of itself won't fix either. But the US has more gun death and violence than all of the other western contries combined yet something else to ponder.

But I do think gun traing and gun safety would help after all you have to get a license and past a test to drive a car why not something simular for having a gun?? Even law enforcement have to get gun certified and recertified?

The point I was trying to make that just the mere fact of more guns won't make you safer, and keeping guns out of the hands of citizens will solve it either. One approach mayne very harsh sentences for criminals even caught with a gun.

The CTA are a bunch of hypocrites. And with thier recent funding problem, you would think they would be smart and take the ads. I also saw an add for Street Kings on a bus yet nothing was said over that. Couldn't R* sue them for breach of contract though?

[...] Following some whining by Fox Chicago, the Chicago Transit Authority (CTA) has decided to pull GTA 4 ads from buses, reports GamePolitics. Previously, GTA San Andreas ads faced criticism from Governor Rod Blagojevich, though that time the transit authority was not so quick to cave. [...]

[...] Seven days from the launch of a game that will probably hurt the box office receipts of Iron Man, I’m keeping myself in check over the deluge of information concerning GTA IV. It’s extremely tough to keep myself in the dark about one of the most anticipated titles in this generation of gaming, but a fresh entrance into the title is something that can’t be understated concerning the cinematic nature of the narrative. One story did mange to slip through the crack though; a piece over at Gamepolitics on the removal of a GTA IV advertisement from Chicago city buses. To sum up the article, the Fox News affiliate in Chicago pressured the transit authority to remove the advertisement. [...]

There are three sides to this coin. First off on a financial side Rockstar won't lose any money with the removals of their ads. I work for the smallest Blockbuster store in our region and we have over 50 presales for the game. Second, I can understand where the city of Chicago might not want to advertise GTA in a time when violence is spiraling out of control, cuz lets face even though the ads didn't depict violence when you say Grand Theft Auto you don't think of cute and cuddly kittens. But on the same note it is wrong for Fox News to try to alienate and demonize (Albeit it's not the first time they've done this.)a game for being the most hazardous thing advertised to children. Hell if they stay up late enough they catch ads for the Playhouse, and I'm pretty sure this is not a child's playhouse. Third, I do believe R*/Take Two should get their money back for the pulling of the ads. I'm not from Chicago but if the CTA is losing money then they shouldn't have let Fox News bully them into pulling the ads or at least asked Fox to cover all the money lost.

[...] According to a report on Monday from GamePolitics, the Chicago Transit Authority (CTA) has caved to minimal pressure from FOX News regarding the use of advertisements promoting the latest installment of Grand Theft Auto IV on public transportation throughout the city. The local Chicago affiliate of the controversial news desk questioned the city’s use of the ads, stating, “With so much focus on kids and violence these days, we wondered why ads for a violent video game have begun popping up again on CTA buses and train stations.” Days later the ads were pulled. [...]

It's not the ads to blame for shootings, it's the gun control problems in the cities. The only guns that should be made are the ones for police, military, and hunting. The government is stupid for letting people carry around guns for "self-defense", the government should fix this gun problem instead of blaming it all on M-Rated games!

[...] The hysteria surrounding the release of GTA IV has officially crossed into the realm of the absurd as moralizing groups of busybodies lead (shockingly) by Fox News successfully forced the transit authorities in Chicago to pull GTA IV ads from their buses. In Miami, professional attention whore Jack Thompson forced the Miami-Dade transit authority to yank GTA IV ads from bus shelters. [...]

Below are actual post from kids and adults (around 80-85% kids though) conversing on an ONLINE MESSAGE BOARD regarding Rockstar Games new title - “GRAND THEFT AUTO IV”. This thread or chat sequence is from a conversation started called “Tell me the sickest thing you‘ve done“. Now this game is only supposed to be sold to adults. Many of these adults either buy it for their children, themselves, or both. When asked about the despicable and controversial content, defenders/players of the game deny this form of entertainment does not harm the subconscious mind. In fact they blame parents for their children’s behavior not games, movies, music, etc. While that defense contains some truth, it contradics itself - because a good parent wouldn’t let their child play a game like GTA . So in essense their calling their parents bad.
For those of you who aren’t familiar with the “GTA” series it involves horrific violence, lewd sex including prostitution, profanity, theft, alluding authorities, and large amounts of other crude and morally depraved acts in a free roam open world atmosphere. That means you have no restrictions, but instead control what and where the player goes and does at anytime in an entire city which contains strip clubs, bars, drug and gun houses, etc. This new game GTA IV has been released on the new High Definition consoles like the Playstation 3 and the X-Box 360, which contain more photo realistic graphics (in other words you pretty much see every bad thing you do. I compiled or copied the post thread so many of you can see what the children (and some irresponsible and mentally unstable adults) are playing. The tone from these players is one of delight and laughter at these acts their admitting to doing in the game. I did not alter the comments, words, or even letters in anyway.

P.S. - LOL means laugh out load for those who don’t know. And Roman and Michelle are characters in the game. Numbered star wanted level is the level of authorities after you which include Police, Feds/Government, and Military. The higher the level the greater the authority will come after you (6 being the highest).

I do not wish to display the name of the board due to legal issues. But it is a well known one.

The comments. Each dash (-) represents a new comment or post starting with the opening post:



- Give it to me, your sickest experiance so far in GTA4. How *beep* up can you get???

- Shot up the hospital. One of the nurses was on the ground pleading and I shot her right in the face. Then after killing everyone inside, I killed all the cops charging in through the front door until I died.

- I cant believe you shot the nurse in the face!

- I cant play till I get home from work, but i am living my sickness through your sickness. So did her head splatter or what?

- Well her head kinda jolted back, and blood splattered all over the ground. And before that, when I first started shooting, there were a bunch of people sitting down. I went up behind some guy, aimed my shotgun at the back of his head and fired. He kinda slumped down onto the ground and everyone started screaming, a few people ran but most of them were kinda crouching on the ground looking scared. I went from person to person with my uzi, killing every single one of them.

Another time I shotgunned an old l