Expert: Grand Theft Auto is Not Why Kids Join Street Gangs

Expert: Grand Theft Auto is Not Why Kids Join Street Gangs

April 29, 2008
Despite claims by game violence critics and some law enforcement personnel, video games like Grand Theft Auto IV are not motivating youthful players to join gangs.

According to the Edmonton Metro, gang expert Michael Chettleburgh says the video game controversy is over-hyped:
If you actually go out and talk to young gang members about the top 10 reasons why they joined a gang, you will never hear them talk about the influences of hip hop, video games or media.

It’s just not a primary driver of why kids join gangs.

Chettleburgh is the author of Young Thugs: Inside the Dangerous World of Canadian Street Gangs.

Via: Next Generation

Comments

there are gangs, it's just not as ig of a problem here than in the bigger city down south but there are. Mostly they deal in criminal activities. drug dealers and teenage prostitution. Not many violent one but in a 500,000 person community you violence is quick to be repressed. From what I know gang violence is a bigger problem in the Montreal area.
Grafitti taggers are an interesting and diverse bunch. In one forum there's a tagger that looks all modest and buttoned up in his wedding picture. Looks like the average clean shaven 30-year old ready to settle down in life. But he has lots of grafitti books, shows off the walls he writes on and his stash of cans and other graf equipment. Maybe he does it to take a bordeom break from the usual hum-ho married life? ;)
Again, someone who shows some sense. Man, these are the people that need to speak, not the likes of Jack Thompson and his ilk.
It's more because they need a family, and their 'family' is dysfunctional, 1 parent who's never home, that sort of thing.
[...] wrote an interesting post today onHere’s a quick excerptDespite claims by game violence critics and some law enforcement personnel, video games like Grand Theft Auto IV are not motivating youthful players to join gangs. According to the Edmonton Metro, gang expert Michael Chettleburgh says the video game controversy is over-hyped: If you actually go out and talk to young gang members about the top 10 reasons why they joined a gang, you will never hear them talk about the influences of hip hop, video games or media. It’s just not a primary driver of why kids join gangs. [...]
Videogames = Expensive = Luxury Items

Street Gangs = poor economic status = poor family structure

The very factors that bring youths to gangs are the very factors preventing said youths from affording games.
I'm in total agreement with this guy and respect his initiative in saying these things, but...well, I just can't help but grin at a book title that includes the words "Canadian Street Gangs" =)
"Young Thugs: Inside the Dangerous World of Canadian Street Gangs."

So tempted to make a joke right now, must resist...

I can't do it. I just can't do it.

Be on the lookout for Canadian street gangs who beat people with hockey sticks drench them in syrup and do drive-by snowball peltings. We understand a maple leaf is their calling card.
The more time you are outside trolling around the streets and looking for stuff to terrorize, the less you stay at home and do indoor stuff like play video games. A real gangsta cares not for video games.

@Zerodash

I wouldn't go as far as to say that poor families. Many poor kids still have video games and cable TV. The assets of inner city poor are not the same as say...third world country poor.
so what are the top 10?
I can name a few

Poverty,education,jobs,peer pressure, stupidity
I'm sorry. The title for that book is not very... its funny. I didn't think there were Canadian gangs... let alone violent ones. All the Canadians I've met are fun.
I really hope this thread doesn't deteriorate into stereotypes about Canada that weren't funny 20 years ago. We may not have the kind of massive gang problem many US cities have (of which I believe I know a main reason of but I won't start that debate here) but it's becoming a big problem here, particularly in central Canada. Here in Ottawa where I live, a massive graffiti epidemic has taken hold in the last couple of years, perpetrated largely by gangs of bored teenagers from the suburbs where there's nothing to do. It used to just be commercial properties but in some parts of the city, they're now started to tag private homes. I live in a pretty good neighbourhood and I fully expect to come home and see my garage door sprayed up one day soon. It's believed that these groups are largely involved in the drug trade as well as it's now almost as easy to get Ecstasy as it is to go out and buy a bag of milk. This issue is a problem everywhere.
Like I said,

Why is a kid going to knock over a liquor store and get busted, when he can do it in GTA with no consequences. In reality, it's really keeping kids off the streets.
If rural white trash America can have gangs any place can!....
@Parallax

"Here in Ottawa where I live, a massive graffiti epidemic has taken hold in the last couple of years, perpetrated largely by gangs of bored teenagers from the suburbs where there’s nothing to do."

And therein lies the difference. Here in S'toon we have two types of gangs. Gangs of low-income people, who are usually after drug money, and gangs of bored teenagers.

The bored teenagers do the most damage. The drug gangs do break-ins (mostly of people who owe them drug money), drug dealing, organized theft (cars, snowmobiles, etc) and prostitution. The bored teenagers do graffiti, steal anything that isn't nailed down, joyride, light fires, and commit tons of petty vandalism. Because if they get caught, they get a slap on the wrist.
People who play video games are in there house instead of being on the street, which makes them less likely to be part of gang activity. Also, many of these gang people are poor, and can't afford games.
I'm glad to see people such as this gentleman getting attention. What is most important here is that he bases his conclusions on actually talking to young gang members. It should be troubling to everyone that nobody has yet raised the question of why aren't claims makers talking to ciminal youth and asking them why they commit crimes or why they join gangs.
@ Velvet_Llama

Because those in power don't want it known that their inability to solve problems and set moral standards are the real issue. It's better to blame games, music, and culture in general for the issues at hand rather than themselves, their failures, and the special interests they cater to in order to increase their own wealth at the expense of increasing those who are impoverished and/or out of work.

Roving "gangs" of teenagers appear when you don't include them in society. Teens rebel against their parents and then go... Where? The mall. Which we, as the adult community, then run them out of because they cause trouble.

The city I live in has decided that night clubs cause "degenerate behavior in youth". So the city is clamping down on the music scene and has successfully closed most of the underage dance clubs (definitely all the popular ones). Now the police are complaining they need more people because the crime rate with the same age demographic has increased exponentially. Hardly a coincidence.

*sigh* You can't expect to ostracize a group from society and then play by the rules that same society has put in place.
@Loudspeaker: In my view of a representative government, those in power should NEVER push issues. In a democratic government, the issues should be pushed from voters to politicians. The general population should be advising the politicians.

So actually, the politicians would be the voters' puppets and not vice versa. But since hardly anyone wants to assume the role of a puppet, real-life politics is turned around and the politicians have the control and push the issues.
With all due respect, the stories are getting a bit absurdly obvious today. GTA doesn't make kids join gangs? Of course they don't! Kids playing GTA are pretty generally sitting comfotably on their couches collecting allowance money, not living in poverty in a harsh environment that breeds gangs.

I don't know that anyone has seriously made such a claim that wasn't just seeking some undeserved attention.
JustChris
The problem is capitalisms unfettered by passes the voters and the those with power subvert the needs of the people for their own.

Steve
Going full tilt to balance out the coming zombie news(causal news) spewing never hurts....
@Loudspeaker

Well said. In a similiar vein to what you said, when we focus on violent media products "causing" crime it gives us a simple target to demonize and attack. What this allows us to do is to ignore the broader structural factors that contribute to stable and predictable patterns of criminality. We are able to blame a folk devil instead of asking difficult questions about the structural inequities of our society or the fact that our economic system isn't working the way we would like to believe that it does.
They join the gangs for status, fellowship, and to make trouble.

Not because GTA told them too. :s

This guy is right on.
There is a saying that if you argue with a crazy person, it's hard not to look like one yourself. Arguing the claim tends to make people think there is something of substance in the initial claim.
Most gangsters probably can't afford GTA. Shit dude, most of them are poor.
Correction Grizzam. Most gangsters don't care for GTA let alone other video games. Why sit in the living room or bedroom all day when real life crime is more thrilling and rewarding to them?
The people I know of who dig GTA the most tend to be members of the middle class who wouldn't think of actually doing any of the things they do in GTA.
I like to make with the 'capping of bishes' on GTA. Would I ever do this in the meat? No. Nor would I frolic around punching every car I step past in the street.
Beg pardon, I'm aboot ta boost ya oover the head with a fookin' hockey stick, eh?
Yeah we could've figured this out ourselves by realising that the crips and bloods have existed long before very violent video games.
This man is right on the money, eh? (Sorry for making that unnecessary eh, I just can't pass up that opportunity)
[...] Expert: Grand Theft Auto is Not Why Kids Join Street Gangs [...]

GamePolitics ShoutBox

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beemoh: @Zip: ...and you'd have to spend all that time re-downloading that porn?
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Posted 11/07/09 at 10:58am
JDKJ: Which could be explained by both (a) and (b).
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:56am
Austin_Lewis: JDKJ: You forgot C) the fact that, for some reason, every time he did something that would suggest he shouldn't be in the military, let alone an officer, higher ups ignored it or let it slide.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:51am
JDKJ: Part of the problem is, I believe, that (a) the Army had a lot of time and money already invested in him and which they were unwilling to simply write-off and (b) an increasing need for the type of skills and services he provided.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:48am
JDKJ: And that even if he was begging not to get cut loose, he was apparently a real good candidate for being cut loose, anyway.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:11am
JDKJ: @chada: And while Kennedy once noted that there's usually more than enough blame for everyone to get a slice, the possibility that the Army was unwilling to cut loose someone who was asking to get cut loose could be a factor.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:07am
ZippyDSMlee: *noms on his feet*..nomnomnomnom*droooll* ...wuuutttttt uuu looking at?
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:05am
JDKJ: I'm no psychologist, but I'm told that crazy people have a tendency to do crazy things.
Posted 11/07/09 at 10:03am
chadachada321: Whoops, was out of the convo for awhile. I do wonder what type of ammo he used etc, but the real issue is WHY he did it, not HOW
Posted 11/07/09 at 09:56am
JDKJ: But if it turns out that they actually did, they'll have Hell to pay.
Posted 11/07/09 at 09:45am
JDKJ: And I'd tend to rule out the possibilty of FN Herstal supplying restricted ammunition to someone merely because they're ordering it from a military base.
Posted 11/07/09 at 09:37am
JDKJ: I know you don't leave your gated community and get around much in dark alleys, so you may be surprised to learn that there's this thing called "the black market" where, if you've got enough money, ain't too much of anything which can't be bought.
Posted 11/07/09 at 09:36am
Austin_Lewis: Or, maybe he or someone else at the base ordered the SS190 from FN Herstal.
Posted 11/07/09 at 09:32am
Austin_Lewis: the hands of private owners. They run about 300 dollars minimum for a box of 50, and boxes of AP 5.7 are extremely scarce, mainly residing in the hands of Class III stores or individuals who for one reason or another got a demo box of it.
Posted 11/07/09 at 09:30am
Austin_Lewis: There are other firearms that fire the 5.7. However, I too would like to know where he got the ammo and what kind was used. Maybe Hasan, planning not to live through this, went out and bought one the boxes of SS190 that are floating around in
Posted 11/07/09 at 08:44am
JDKJ: And it isn't yet clear what type of ammunition Hasan used. It's strange that he purchased a gun but didn't purchase ammunition for it at the same place and time. Especially because the calibre required is peculiar to the actual gun.
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