What we can expect to happen within the year of GTAIV, given a 3 to 1 chance;

-Cop or Civilian is shot, Injured or Killed

-Criminal and/or victim places blame on GTAIV

-UNFair and UNBalanced press and lawyers and critics complain

-1st Ammendment Rights are cited, cycle repeats itself (can't wait till GTAV!)

So, instead of just repeating the usual obvious banter, come up with a suggestion that might make this more public, I don't know, like........
Jerry Springer?

Just throwing ideas...

@NovaBlack:

I thought it was:

Can I have GTA4?
No.
WAHHHHHHHH
HHHHHHHHHH
HHHHHHHHHH
Okay okay if it'll shut you up... sir can I have a copy of GTA4?

"Being involved in a shootout in a video game has no consequences and that is the wrong message to send to young people."

Agreed. So when do we outlaw paintball? And laser tag. And water guns. And little kids running around pointing their forefingers at each other making "Pew! Pew! Pew!" noises.

Always with the assumptions that gamers are total morons. "Hey, I just shot that guy in a *game* and there were no consequences! That must mean I can totally do that in real life! Wheeee!"

I absolutely agree that the context of games, movies, books, television shows, smells, etc. can stir up emotions from our past, but that is no reason to start banning the content. How many WWII shooters are there?

If watching Robocop at the age if eight didn't cause me to go out and start shooting cops then Grand Theft Auto certainly won't

I feel sorry for the mother's loss none the less.

[...] wrote an interesting post today onHere’s a quick excerptIt’s difficult to imagine the sense of shock and loss experienced by the loved ones of a police officer killed in the line of duty. So it’s not surprising to read in today’s New York Daily News that the mother of slain NYPD Officer Russel Timoshenko (left) doesn’t appreciate the cops-and-robbers animated violence in Grand Theft Auto IV. Tatyana Timoshenko told the Daily News: For some people, it’s a game. But for me, it’s not funny. It was for real. It was my son. This game teaches children to kill, then they wonder where criminals come from. [...]

I'm sorry, but this guy was apparently shot in July of last year. What does that have to do with GTA IV? The defendants are also all ex-cons that appear to be in their late 20's or early 30's. They're *adults*, not *kids*. Also, given those ages, even if they did play games as kids it wasn't a GTA game! It would been Mario, Punch-Out, StarFox and other games like that. It's just not a valid comparison.

ARRRRGH!!!

The M on the box must not stand for Mature, it must stand for Moron since these GTA games seem to attract them in droves. The games rated 17+ THAT MEANS ITS NOT FOR ****ING KIDS!!!

Also, again with the no consequences BS when your involved in shootouts. Your wanted level goes up, more cops, and even the FBI and Military get involved and if you do get killed or busted, you lose your weapons and have to start over, damn.

"For some people, it’s a game. But for me, it’s not funny. It was for real. It was my son. This game teaches children to kill, then they wonder where criminals come from."

Grats, you've forever cheapened and sullied the memory of your son. I cannot believe that you actually hijacked your own personal tragedy for such a &^@#ing foolish 'cause'.

so if this teaches the kids to kill....what teaches the nypd to unload their weapons at innocent civilians?

"This game teaches children to kill, then they wonder where criminals come from."

I guess the formation of the kkk, nazi's, black panther party, aarion brotherhood, street gangs, and the rest of the terrorist are gamers. So much for that oppinion. YOU ARE THE COMPANY YOU KEEP!!!

@ Bungles Danforth

The same game that teaches them to taser people to death, run drugs, and act like an occupying force?

they are more concerned about kids learning to have sex with prostitutes in a video game...then they might learn it from their governor

Today mark the first day of my new campaign named : The Punic Wars were started by GTAIV... since it seems blaming crime and porn on GTAIV isn't enough to get it banned I shall blame the eradication of an empire on it then maybe GTA will be banned from being sold to kids (age being anyone who plays videogames). One of my long dead ancestor died during those wars so Take two people have his blood on their hands.

And if this doesn't work I'll start blaming supernovas on it... you have got to ban a game that can blow stars up. Who's with me? With all the lies and knowledge, I'm bound to get some TV time and newspaper time.

And stop thinking of taking weak measures like locking the games under the counter. Gather them all in the ceter of town and let's organize mass burning. We shall also have to eliminate any person that has once in his lifetime played a videogame they might be killers biding for their times when they take out their rocket launchers and try to rocket jump everywhere.

Be ever watchful unless plumbers eat mushrooms to grow twice their size and start jumping on people's head to kill them.

i think we can successfully blame COD 1,2 and 3 for causing World War 2.

Vinzent stole my comment, so I'll have to make a new one...

See, where they go wrong is that GTAIV is a game, even if it is a mature game.

What do you want from a game? Should you BLEED if you get shot in the game? Whould you have prefered if people actually DIED when they "lost a life" in Pac-Man?

There are repercusions in the game if you do something bad, however, in this game you are a relatively bad guy. Why? Because they have a lot of the good guy games already covered. It is a pretty untapped market.

Tell you what, you make a "MacDonald's Smile Game" and put it up against this one, maybe you can use sales pressure to push it out of the market. Maybe I'm actualy the reincarnation of Ghandi as well.

Movies with an anti-hero are common. This game is no more detailed or realistic then them, actually a lot less. It isn't a kids game so saying that it teaches kids this or that is hogwash. The moment you tell us that an adult can't play a game because kids might get their hands on it, is the moment that you also condem all movies, writings, alcohol, cigarettes, and guns with that exact same argument.

@ Arad

Under-achiever...

playing tag shouldn't be allowed becuase it makes someone 'it'. When someone is 'it' they are being unfairly discriminated against.

Lady, it sucks that your son died, but really, stop with the game blame. I can go into so many details and arguements, but I don't feel I need to. Just stop. As for you Bloomberg, shut the fuck up. The shit you claim is RETARDED. Everyone and their mommas' know that. A goddamn game can't teach a kid to kill, for reasons that have been pointed out by everybody. Also, what about kids who train in some sort of martial art? A lot of kids do that, and yet I don't see them tearing ass all around punching people in the ribs. That's because they were taught to be responsible with what they know. It's not that hard.

@ Guiguibob80

isn't that a movie?

I don't know if they made a movie about the book by Ray Bradbury. But it's the book I keep thinking about.

@ Guiguibob80 & Dungles Danforth

LOL! I don't think there's a Farenheit 451 movie. A video game of it would have some awesome irony though.

You know, you'd think there'd be SOME risk of death or injury being in the force.

Although I have much respect for the police for fighting on our behalf, the mother is simply seeking something to blame for her loss.

GTA4 has barely been out after a day and already blame is being passed for a crime. Well, that was quick.

"For some people, it’s a game. But for me, it’s not funny. It was for real. It was my son. "

I'm truly sorry for your loss, but I don't care about how you feel about this game. I don't care who finds it funny and who doesn't - I myself enjoy it and that's all that matters to my. Conversly, my opinion should not matter to you. Now that we accept that, realize the world does NOT revolve around you just because you suffered a loss - while horrible, we all suffer them.

"This game teaches children to kill, then they wonder where criminals come from."

Prove this game teaches children to kill. Then, with your implication that this game causes criminals, prove that it does. And explain how it was possible that criminals existed before video-games did. Like, thousands of years. Then explain how crime has dropped as video-games became more mainstream and popular.

"The kids are playing these violent games that don’t exactly teach the kind of things that you’d want to teach your kids."

So don't let your kids play them. But since I HAVE ACTUALLY PLAYED THE GAME, I know for a fact that it does not TEACH YOU that there are rewards for killing police - in fact, it teaches you there are LIFE AND DEATH penalties. And those "points" everyone says you get for copy killing, which is actually money, you LOSE for doing it.

"Being involved in a shootout in a video game has no consequences and that is the wrong message to send to young people."

Actually, there is TONS of in-game consequences. If you say that in-game consequences have no real-life affect, then you acknowledge that in-game rewards have no real-life effect. It doesn't work both ways.

Another ignorant idiot who can't back up her claims. I'm deeply sorry for your loss, but that doesn't excuse stupidity.

@Justin:

"And there are no fake politicians in the fake city to fight fake gun crimes."

This made me LOL for some reason, maybe its all the "real" politicians being up in arms every time a new one of these dares to be released...

@ Justin

I just wanted to say.... I loved you post

Awsome

;-)

Dear Mrs Timoshenko

I am sorry for you loss, but I have no sympathy for someone who is scapegoating something just because it is "cool" to do so. When you have matured a bit and understand it is a game NOT meant for children, feel free to try again.

sincerely DCOW

“Being involved in a shootout in a video game has no consequences and that is the wrong message to send to young people.”

Bullshit. These people never played GTA IV. Being in a shoot out with a cop never happens unless it is on your terms, and then it still leads to the same issue. Most time you're shooting at a cop, there are five million cops shooting back at you. Perhaps dying in a video game is not a bad consequence in a game since it obviously doesn't stick, but I've found my self being far more cautious in GTA IV than I have been in the past games. Fleeing from the cops can be easy, but it can be a bitch as well on this game.

Me and Roman decided to go to a bar and have a little beer. Afterwards, I decided I'd drive us back. Needless to say some poor citizens of Liberty didn't go home that night (including Roman by the end of it all since he went to the hospital). Let me tell you, there are consequences for drunk driving, and fleeing from the cops is no fun while drunk.

That just brings me back to the point that I think Rockstar did, in a small sense, program this game to have more of a consequence for doing illegal things far better than previous games that I could survive for half a hour destroying everything and everybody in my path. I will not do that on this game. I may attempt it, but I do not think I'll last for more than 2 minutes with a three star much less four star rating (not even gonna go to five).

You shouldn't even trust the NYPD after those three cops were aquitted of murder.

This game teaches children to kill, then they wonder where criminals come from.
I hate how people think that criminals are easily made. Criminals know they are doing is wrong, and they choose to be wrong.

If Criminals are made, then they act as they do because they look at the world as something that tortures you. If the world doesn't help you, then you hate the world. If you grow up in an abusive family or really bad bulling, then you feel like you have the right to abuse back.

Video games just doesn't do that to you. Video games allow you to express your feeling in the video game and not in the real world. Video games are helping, not hurting.

"This game teaches children to kill, then they wonder where criminals come from."

Hey I wonder where they came from before the invention of television.

@Brandon - in GTA4, when you die / get hospitalised you don't lose your weapons.

Rockstar Game Design team FTW!

"This game teaches children to kill, then they wonder where criminals come from."

I did not know video games exiisted throughout Al Capone's prime (sarcasm).

@Ken
I 100% agree.

There are numerous causes for violence. I doubt GTA is the but for cause, as in "but for GTA the video game such and such police officer would have not been shot." While violence as entertainment in a video game is offensive to many people who don't regularly play video games, horrific mind numbing violence in U.S. history predates video games by generations. Want to see how gruesome and violent society was before television, the internet at R*? Check out this photo history of racial violence (lynching) in the U.S. at http://www.withoutsanctuary.org/main.html but beware IT'S NOT for the feint of heart. Keep in mind that it only became illegal to send postcards of these atrocities in the 1930s. There are also children present in some of these pictures, with smiling adults.

Yeah well if the NYPD has taught us recently with the whole Sean Bell trail is that apparently its wrong for people to shoot cops in a video game but its ok for cops to shoot people in real life.

I just thank goodness that Conan is coming out in the Summer.

If this had been released in Winter you can imagine all the kids suffering Pneumonia as they run around the streets in furry pants trying to cut the heads off people in their mad psychotic 'game rage'.
Yup, as its obvious to every non-gamer, these games are real life simulators training our kids to be nutbags. I fear for our streets when Conan is released !!!

"For some people, it’s a game. But for me, it’s not funny. It was for real. It was my son. This game teaches children to kill, then they wonder where criminals come from."

Crime has been around since, i don't know forever. Did you know when the goverment created the 18th amendment it also created organized crime in the U.S.

@Matt - that's not really a fair argument here, is it?

Devil's advocate time!

Let us suppose that GTA is a cop-killing simulator. Now, we'll ask the GP audience, most of whom have probably logged numerous hours in Liberty City and the like: What's the easiest, safest, and most efficient way of killing a cop?

A) Shoot them.
B) Run them over.

Anyone reckon that GTA trains you to take option A?

@SteveUK

to be honest i call everyone with a shaved head a skinhead

Being involved in a shootout in a video game has no consequences and that is the wrong message to send to young people.


Sure it does. You lose all your weapons (and they are expensive in GTA4 because money is hard to come by) and some cash. Plus, more often than not, it leads to failed missions.

Just sayin' is all...

GTA4 should not be banned.  I enjoy the game myself.  I can see, however, why it may not be considered morally right to have fun slaughtering police officers even if fictional.  I would contend that GTA adds to the already rampant demonization and hatred for cops that subsists in many urban areas around the US.  I doubt that GTA would drive anyone to kill unless they were already unstable enough to kill someone.