ECA: Net Neutrality, Universal Broadband Sections of Stimulus Package Are Good For Gamers

Congress is currently considering President Barack Obama’s economic stimulus package, a measure which contains some extra goodies for gamers and Internet users.

Because Net Neutrality and Universal Broadband provisions contained in the bill will stimulate the online gaming experience, the Entertainment Consumers Association is providing gamers with an easy way to let their elected officials in Washington, D.C. know that they support the stimulus package.

To that end, the ECA has launched an action campaign at its website. Members and non-members alike can use the page to send a letter urging their congressional representatives to get behind the stimulus legislation. From the ECA site:

Net Neutrality and Universal Broadband are not only great for America; they allow us to play the games we want at high speeds!

Now is the time to act and let our voices be heard.  The new stimulus package… would provide for $2.8 billion in grants to develop broadband connections in underserved and rural populations… the bill also requires that any infrastructure built with the grant money has "open access basis" which would be defined by the new administration’s FCC, but which seems to mirror Network Neutrality guidelines…

FULL DISCLOSURE DEPT: The ECA is the parent company of GamePolitics.

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  1. 0
    TJLK says:

    I don’t think that the ECA has bad intentions either.  The ECA doing what they perceive as helpful to gamers.

    Personally I see a great deal of division among gamers(and ECA members) concerning Net Neutrality and Universal Broadband.

  2. 0
    T5 says:

    Mr. Schenker let us please be realistic in this endeavour and as currently proposed and supported by the ECA this back door way to Net Neutrality is governemnt intervention.  "It" says? It being? "discriminate" define it, enforce it? you see how this could accuratly be portrayed as govermental interference.  If that is what the ECA supports, then come out and say it, but please stop trying to swipe these points under the rug.

    Loved the thoughtful response to foolkiller though, answered his questions perfectly. 

    THe ECA does have great potential, but please let us be honest and open in this dialogue menaing you cannot possibly see Net Neutrality as anything but the government’s hand in ways not seen since TVA. 

  3. 0
    Brett Schenker says:

    "I don’t think the ECA has any bad intentions, they just want all gamers to have access to the fun that is online gaming."

    While you might disagree with the action, thank you for recognizing this.

    Brett Schenker

    Online Advocacy Manager

    the ECA

  4. 0
    E. Zachary Knight says:

    You know, that may sound good right now, but you are only looking at one aspect of it. Sure one customer who uses the internet primarily for gaming will benefit from it, but what about those who like to do on-line gaming but also have business needs? Are you seriously asking them to choose which one they want to be prioritized? Or perhaps someone who streams a lot of videos as well as games. You know the 360 and PS3 don’t just do games right?

    The internet is not just a one use system. It has thousands of uses. Millions perhaps. What if someone chooses the gaming tier and their priorities change. They will have to pay extra fees to have their tier changed to match their constantly changing needs every time.

    Also think about the business side of things. How would one get on that "Gaming Tier"? Will the ISP be in charge of finding gaming services and websites to prioritize or will each and every company have to search out every single ISP in the world and make sure they are on that gaming tier for each and every ISP in the World. That sounds like a lot of work and lot of money that could be saved by leaving all packets alone and making them the same priority.

    Someone complained that email would get the same priority as games. Well that is true, but bandwidth wise they are not equal. So while email will not be hampered while you play games and vise versa, email as it requires very little bandwidth will not be detrimental to your gaming experience.

    So if ISPs really feel that gaming or movie streaming etc is negatively affecting their bandwidth, perhaps rather than degrade those high bandwidth packets, they should concentrate on expanding their network to accommodate. It may cost a little in the short run, but it will bring in more profits in the long run.

    E. Zachary Knight
    Oklahoma City Chapter of the ECA

    E. Zachary Knight
    Divine Knight Gaming
    Oklahoma Game Development
    Rusty Outlook
    Random Tower
    My Patreon

  5. 0
    foolkiller79 says:

    I am sorry, but I have to step in here to make one of my rare comments.

    First, I am hands-off to the government on every issue.  So, to start with I am immediately opposed to net neutrality and universal broadband because I refuse to violate my own principles in order to get my favored activities "improved."

    Second, it seems to me that the ECA and other net neutrality/universal broadband supporters are trying to push this into a stimulus bill.  Why?  My best guess is that the stimulus package will go through and by sliding this in then you guarantee that it will not have the honest and open debate that an issue of this nature deserves.  It should be its own separate issue, not one snuck in behind helping people keep jobs (whether this or any stimulus package can do that is a different debate).

    Now, to bring in my personal experience living in Frankfort, KY.  We have the Frankfort Plant Board, which was an entity founded by the local government in the mid-50’s and now controls cable, broadband, phone, and electric.  Basically, the only resource they don’t control is water.  Now, the prices they offer are cheaper than the Insight Communications systems in the surrounding cities.  But what am I saving?  Disney Channel only became available last year.  Food Network not long before that.  If I want FX I have to go with their digital package, and they charge a $99 one-time fee to put your encryption security card in the digital tuner box.  And my Internet?  Well, for a cheap rate I can get 1mb down and 128kb up.  I get a lot of lag in my games.  I could upgrade, but the prices quickly jump up.  Their best package, at $51, is 8mb up and 512kb down.  But if I were living 10 miles down the interstate in either direction I would pay $40 for 10mb down and 1mb up, and that is Insight’s minimum package.  They also offer a 20mb package. 

    Now, I have seen references made to ConnectKentucky and their claims as to how well this kind of thing can work.  I have friends out in the fringes of the county that managed to get broadband through one of their programs.  Somehow I have yet to see anything dealing with ConnectKentucky that mentions maximum download limits.  My friends’ son tried to play a game online and in one night he hit the maximum limit, that they had not been told about up front (they claim), and they spent the rest of the month at dial-up speeds.  Yeah, that sounds like we will get a lot more gamers, but only for a few hours a month.  I didn’t even know there were download limits left in America.

    The benefits of all of this for gamers is clouded in mystery and issues like download limits need to be addressed before we even attempt to put this in a bill.  There is too much to be discussed for us to slide this in a piece of feel-good legislation. 

    I don’t think the ECA has any bad intentions, they just want all gamers to have access to the fun that is online gaming.  But I think they have gotten so focused on access of any kind that they haven’t paused to make sure the consumers they support/represent are getting proper treatment in this.  Guaranteeing a line outside someone’s house does not guarantee them anything more than the ability to run a connection into their home.  What kind of connection though?  If the ECA actually cares they will move to pull net neutrality/universal broadband from this package and give it the attention it deserves.  What other issues may be getting overlooked? 

    I disagree with the ECA on net neutrality in general because forcing money from my pocket to give crappy broadband to someone else is wrong on many, many levels.  But I do believe they have the consumer’s best interest at heart (even if it is not my best interest), and as such I highly suggest they make sure what they want and what they are getting is the same thing before they lobby to move it forward.  So far the government initiated rural broadband that I have seen first-hand has been like every other government initiated program, wasteful crap. 

    Now, before this discussion goes any further, can anyone who supports this plan guarantee that the broadband service provided to rural areas will be equal to the service provided to high population dense areas? 

    Like any good political entity the ECA has jumped without looking.

  6. 0
    LMLM says:

    attn: thelobbyist – I wholeheartedly agree. Net Neutrality in its current form is a hoax and your example is one of many. The real problem is the monopolies that are systematically handed out to cable and phone companies and the Net Neutrality movement seems to be doing nothing to dismantle them. This is the problem. If competition is allowed to prosper, we won’t need laws regulating packet flows..

  7. 0
    T5 says:

    We trust them because we value freedom of enterprise? The government has a place in all this to be sure, but more so as a referee.  Historically the type of government intervention being proposed has bee less then stellar.    

    Your question can be flipped, why trust massive government intervention.  A historical parallel would be the TVA, as presented in the New Deal, the idea that federal government can maintain and run a service that is beneficial to the entire region, this is of course did not work as the TVA is now one of the worst power plants in the country.  This was to be the model, now the argument is Net Neutrality and the government is in danger of running into the same problems and they are not offering any plausible ideas for the future.  How can the ECA so blindly and so willfully trust the government on this?

    I also urge you to respond to other posts here including: LMLM, TJLK, and foolkiller79


  8. 0
    Brett Schenker says:

    Sadly we’ve seen ISP providers in fact won’t do this.  Arstechnica  has reported that Comcast, a major ISP provider, has in fact been giving their own VoIP services special treatment over competitors,  This is a perfect example of an isp offering services and using their control to hurt their competitor’s services.

    "The agency has asked Comcast to provide "a detailed justification for Comcast’s disparate treatment of its own VoIP service as compared to that offered by other VoIP providers on its network." The latest knock on the door comes from FCC Wireline Bureau Chief Dana Shaffer and agency General Counsel Matthew Berry."

    Comcast is currently fighting the FCC’s earlier decision against them about p2p throttling in court.

    The telecoms past behaviour has been against net neutrality, why should we trust them to abide by on their own in the future?

    Brett Schenker

    Online Advocacy Manager

    the ECA

  9. 0 says:

    The ECA is completely backwards on their net neutrality stance. Net neutrality will enforce having all packets treated equally. This will prevent new technologies like prioritizing gaming traffic. Gaming traffic and other time sensitive data like high def streaming movies will be treated the same as non-time sensitive email traffic.

    Let’s say your ISP wants to develop a tier called a Gaming Tier. You pay a little extra, but all your gaming traffic is prioritized on their network so that you don’t experience lag in the online gaming environment. If net neutrality is enforced and regulated, innovation like this never has a chance to come about.

    Why the ECA is backing this is completely beyond me.

  – live it, love it, debate

  10. 0
    shady8x says:

    I am sorry but the stimulus package is really needed…


    right now there are arrow manufacturers and alcohol makers that desperatly need this money to continue to supply our army with arrows and kill 100,000 americans yearly(thats the alcohol not arrows)…


    Besides if we don’t bail out companies now then how will they know that they don’t have to run a business responsibly? Why, they might even stop unsustainable practices… no no no we have to teach companies that no matter how much the screw up we will always rob the tax paiers and make sure those CEO continue getting 20 mil per year…

  11. 0
    T5 says:

    While your philosophy is appreciated (and dead on) this argument can be solved with a few examples.  First is the idea of a private and public sector relationship that works towards the mutual goals of broadband access on a state level.  For those paying attention this has been done, a good example being connectkentucky (who ironically is affiliated with an ECA affiliate).  The more research that is done into this successful organization it becomes clear that a federal approach could damage their success and what’s more has no guarantee of being effective. 

    The goal of universal broadband is noble, but a massive amount of federal level interference could be very determinate to its prosperity.

    How does the ECA justify tandem support for Universal Broadband and Net Neutrality as both seem at odds save course massive government intervention and controls are adopted?

  12. 0
    LMLM says:

    E. Zachary Knight – Technology evolves and advances. What was impossible 20 years ago is now done easily and cheaply. So instead of spending other people’s money to help your small town get broadband, I suggest you wait until technology makes it affordable and practical.

    Think for a second as to how this money you want is obtained. It is obtained by means of coercion, violence. If people don’t pay their taxes, they have action forcibly taken against them. If people want to use another currency, one that is not diluted by the government’s inflationary policies by spending on programs like this, they are arrested and some type of harm is done against them.

    Maybe my pointing out that this coercion seems unimportant to you. But look at the violence underneath the ‘good intentions.’ Look at how we become serfs. You mean well, but the result is that we lose freedom, for supposed security.

    Why not let technology improve and solve the problem by itself without politics and big brother/sister dictating to us what is best. Politicians and bureaucrats don’t know what is best, except for themselves.

  13. 0
    Good Lord says:

    "If people don’t pay their taxes, they have action forcibly taken against them. If people want to use another currency, one that is not diluted by the government’s inflationary policies by spending on programs like this, they are arrested and some type of harm is done against them."

    Newsflash: Part of being a citizen involves paying taxes to the country you live in. Part of being a citizen means being involved in the economy of the country you live in.

    Do you think the roads you drive on build themselves?

  14. 0
    Wolvenmoon says:

    We could do this by taking off laws that gave ISPs exclusive access to leased lines, and not spend a dime.

    As it stands now ISPs get exclusive access to run their cabling alongside power lines and such if they outbid the other ISPs. It’s why you don’t have access to multiple cable or DSL providers in one place.

    Hey, look, 2.8 billion in tax payer dollars saved, and incentive for technological growth right there.

  15. 0
    DeepThorn says:

    The internet is just an excuse, and why not push for fiber optic?  It needs to start sometime, why not now?  The technology and tried and tested in Mass. and it works.

    I am sick of this stimulus package crap.  Let them know they have to sink or swim on their own, and the government will NOT back them up on their death bed, because if they get their asses bailed out, I want my ass bailed out for my "Company" too.  I think a clean $5 million will do it, and I will sign a waver that says I will not spend it all before or after for some insane vacation or other needless things.

    No more bail outs, no more stimulus packages, just Americans putting hard work into things like they used to do.  When did this damn country start acting so needy and letting people out the easy way.   You earn your position, and you keep it until someone else knocks you down, you make a dumbass mistake, or there is no need for your services anymore.

    Greedy CEOs in bed with politicians is a huge problem that needs to stop.  Politicians in their position just for financial gain and not to serve this country to make it a better place need to be booted out.  All in all, this mess needs cleaned up, and greed needs to be cleaned out, which includes shutting down the oil company in the US IMO because we have technology to replace it, and at a reasonable price.  Granted, it may take 20+ years, it is the direction we need to go some day, might as well start today, and try to get it done in 10 years.  Using solar and wind isn’t only eco friendly, which I think is BS anyways, but it is just logical and cost efficient long term, and can supply just as many jobs with lower risk of life.

    Nido Web Flash Tutorials AS2 and AS3 Tutorials for anyone interested.
    How to set Xbox 360 Parental Controls

  16. 0
    Solipsis says:

    Where my parents live there’s no cable at all. You literally can’t get it. It’s satellite or nothing. There’s also one extremely overpriced DSL provider and because they have a monopoly, they’re extremely difficult to work with and provide next to nothing by way of customer service or support.

    Kind of nuts, really, considering I live less than two hours away and can choose from four or five different options for broadband.  

  17. 0
    Nekowolf says:

    Or hopefully more competition. Like here, I live out in the rural. We have only one cable provider, Charter, and that’s it. If you want cable, it’s either Charter or none. Granted, we can get satellite, but there’s also a number of trees and I know a few people who can’t without getting some kind of tower installed.

  18. 0
    Conejo says:

    and universal broadband in such areas would provide more technology jobs and theoretically lure more people to populate underpopulated areas.

    Here are we — and yonder yawns the universe.

  19. 0
    Brett Schenker says:

    "they are referring specifically to the $2.8 Billion proposition.  However consider the impact made when the representative receives this letter.  Is it not possible to perceive this as a letter supporting the stimulus package?  A reason to vote yes on it?  If this is true have you not inadvertently endorsed the entirety of it?  I believe this is the case and to say this isn’t about disagree or agreeing with the stimulus package is absolutely confusing to me as the way I’m reading strait it off the website reflects otherwise."

    I’m going to disagree as the letter clearly states "As your constituent and a video game player, I ask you to support the Broadband and Net Neutrality provisions in the economic stimulus bill, particularly the $2.8 billion set aside for Internet development grants."

    No where in the letter does it state that the ECA is in favor of the bill.


    Brett Schenker

    Online Advocacy Manager

    the ECA

  20. 0
    E. Zachary Knight says:

    So because some ISP wasn’t lucky enough to be the ISP of Google or Ebay, they should have the right to charge those companies in order for that ISP to allow customers to reach them? That sure sonds fair. I can’t wait for every large company has to pay every ISP in the world in order to gain access to their customers.

    E. Zachary Knight
    Oklahoma City Chapter of the ECA

    E. Zachary Knight
    Divine Knight Gaming
    Oklahoma Game Development
    Rusty Outlook
    Random Tower
    My Patreon

  21. 0
    TJLK says:

    Let’s negate the stimulus package from the discussion momentarily and focus on Net Neutrality and Universal Broadband.  I’ll start out by respectfully disagreeing with the notion that this is not a Red, Blue, or Purple issue.  It absolutely is.  If you’re discussing risks, benefits, dangers or any other possible consequences of a piece of legislation you’re going to have to look into your personal opinions on the matter.  Thus choosing to support a piece of legislation based on what you believe is the best interest of the industry, the individual, society or law code requires you to ponder your morals, values, beliefs, political alliances and probably quite a few other things. The only way to not to consider this a red, blue or purple issue is to take no stance at all.

    It is a debate on whether or not it is wise to have the Government involved with an industry both in terms of finance and regulation.  Some people believe it is in the best interest of the people to have Government provide them with social regulation, social services, or any other forms of aid/assistance.  Others believe that it is in direct conflict with individual liberty to have a Government that becomes too involved in regulating society, or providing aid to a select group of individuals(be it because of race, location or social class).  Many find their beliefs in between or even off in completely different directions.  The fact that there are multiple sides and views to choose from on such issues is the very foundation of a free society is all about.

    I respect the fact that many ECA members have been supporting and fighting for Net Neutrality and Universal Broadband because they believe it will have a positive impact.  But what I feel is not respected or maybe just perhaps overlooked is that there are, in fact, ECA members that believe that Net Neutrality and Universal Broadband will be extremely detrimental not only to the game industry but also to their individual liberty.  I personally know a few that disagree with Net Neutrality and Universal Broadband that I have discussed this with extensively.  I also personally know a few that support the idea of Net Neutrality and Universal Broadband.  Both sides are equally informed but because we have different opinions on what responsibilities the Government should hold we disagree.

    Those in opposition to Net Neutrality or Universal Broadband aren’t commonly ignorant on what the legislation is about but rather simply have different opinions on what is best for them as consumers of games and interactive entertainment products.  Same can be said about those who support Net Neutrality and Universal Broadband.  I’m sure there are a great deal of individuals that have researched these proposals and formed their opinions on if it will be beneficial or detrimental.  Was there ever a time in which the stance on this issue open to discussion among ECA members?  If not, then why?   If so, when was it and how did I miss it?  If the members can’t have an impact on whether or not the ECA as a whole supports pieces of legislation then what is the point of it all?  I’m sure you understand what I’m trying to communicate in terms of how frustrating this is to some members that oppose Net Neutrality and Universal Broadband.

    Back to the stimulus plan.  I’ve opted to use my voice to oppose it and all measures included in it.  I have a habit of calling my representatives frequently about everything.  This is because I believe it will negatively impact the country.  Both in terms of the economy and individual liberty I wholly believe that the Stimulus Package, Net Neutrality and Universal Broadband will all have negative impacts.  As a gamer, meaning when I’m only considering the effects of games and the industry in which creates, distributes and sells them, I still think it will have a negative impact.  I think it is a dangerous idea and can do serious damage in many different ways.  Why?  I’m a Libertarian that leans toward the Conservative side of the spectrum so the choices I make and the ideas I express will reflect that in many cases.  Now to say these e-mails you’re recommending individuals to send to their representatives are only representing the portions of the stimulus package that are related to Net Neutrality and Universal Broadband is technically true but still a bit misleading.  Yes in the letter the ECA specifically states they are referring specifically to the $2.8 Billion proposition.  However consider the impact made when the representative receives this letter.  Is it not possible to perceive this as a letter supporting the stimulus package?  A reason to vote yes on it?  If this is true have you not inadvertently endorsed the entirety of it?  I believe this is the case and to say this isn’t about disagree or agreeing with the stimulus package is absolutely confusing to me as the way I’m reading strait it off the website reflects otherwise.

    I realize not all members are going to completely see eye to eye on everything and I honestly believe that aspect is important to retain and respect.  I also understand why the ECA has chosen to support these ideas and why.  What I am having trouble with is why there wasn’t any dialogue on whether or not the members agreed or disagreed with Net Neutrality or Universal Broadband.  I joined during the campaign to "Keep Government Out Of Games".  You must understand how this endorsement is inconsistent with that campaign.  This is inviting the Government to have a direct impact on games.  That is completely undeniable.  You may think the impact will be good but that is subjective.  Both sides of this understand that there will be an impact. I didn’t join for a few free magazines, free game trials or any of the other benefits the ECA offers.  Sure those things are all awesome and I try to take advantage of the ones I’m interested in.  The real reason I joined was to keep Government out of games because I believe it is required for prosperity for the industry and the consumer.

  22. 0
    LMLM says:

    One of the important reasons our economy is in such shambles is because politicians systematically spend our money or borrowed money (our federal budget is almost 3 TRILLION!) and regulate our interest rates to create artificial bubbles so they can wage their wars and spend ‘stimulus packages’ that are really more corporate and social welfare packages that rarely solve problems but perpetuate them. Our grossly unconstitutional government is a primary cause poverty in this country, not limited broadband access.

    You speak as if broadband access is some sort of birthright or necessity for living. It isn’t! I gamed for many years without Internet broadband in the 70s, 80s and first half of the 90s. I denounce the idea that the government should provide incentives while at the same time greatly prohibiting competition in the marketplace by systematically granting monopolies to cable and phone companies.

    I know what you really are. You are playing the money game system that is already in place. This system that this bailout encourages is a large scale bribery network. You want your piece of the pie of greed at the expense of others.

    The ends do NOT justify the means. Computer gaming and the Internet should have a large divide from government for VERY GOOD REASONS. Free speech and freedom of expression are important civil rights and these types of ‘government knows best’ programs set the precedent that government should be involved in them. They should not.

  23. 0
    T5 says:

    This does not discount the research however, afterall the ECA is supported by the likes of MoveOn but we do not disocunt everything you do. Mind the fallacies. 

  24. 0
    Brett Schenker says:

    The US dropped to 20th at 26.4% broadband penetration, behind tiny Estonia. The US has fallen from 19th to 20th place in broadband penetration since the second quarter of 2008.

    How it profits:

    1) A 2007 study by the Brookings Institute and MIT found that for every one-digit increase in the U.S. per-capita broadband penetration rate an additional 300,000 American jobs would be created. A modest 10 point boost in US broadband penetration would mean 3 million additional jobs.

    2) In a study by Connected Nation, the U.S. could realize an economic impact of $134 billion annually by accelerating broadband availability across all states.

    Brett Schenker

    Online Advocacy Manager

    the ECA

  25. 0
    Austin_Lewis says:

    ‘Millions’?  I doubt that very much.  I know of a few tens of thousands in each state, and many times these people don’t want it anyway.

    Universal Broadband shouldn’t be included in the stimulus package.  How does that profit us as a country?  How does it profit us as an economy?

  26. 0
    Austin_Lewis says:

    How are we going to give people the opportunity to access it without it being free?  Do you know what the money earmarked for that is actually going to go to?  What ‘incentives’ will there be for a company to build infrastructure to places in the middle of bumfuck nowhere where they have to take a 2 hour drive in order to service said infrastructure?

  27. 0
    Brett Schenker says:

    Where did I say anything about free broadband?  This is giving people the opportunity to access it, not giving it to them for free.  And it’s doing so by helping giving incentives to build the infrastructure to underserved communities and rural schools.

    Brett Schenker

    Online Advocacy Manager

    the ECA

  28. 0
    Austin_Lewis says:

    Nevermind that most of the places where broadband is available for free are places where its either A) impossibly slow or B) areas where no one has a computer.  What’s wrong with people having to go to libraries if they need a computer with internet access?

  29. 0
    E. Zachary Knight says:

    You do realize that there are millions of people in the US that can afford broadband internet but the only thing that is keeping them from getting it is the fact that it is not offered in their area, right?

    That is what the goal of universal broadband is. To bring Broadband interent to those areas that want it but are not "profitable" enough to the ISPs. I put profitable in quotes because they like to make up excuses based around short term losses rather than long term profits.

    I still cannot understand the business sense some people have. "Oh it will take 5 years to get the return on investment of expanding to this area. We can’t do that as it will shorten our earnings for this year." They don’t take into account the thousands to millions of potential long term customers they will have gained. I for one will completely change ISPs if a cheaper faster internet connection were offered.

    E. Zachary Knight
    Oklahoma City Chapter of the ECA

    E. Zachary Knight
    Divine Knight Gaming
    Oklahoma Game Development
    Rusty Outlook
    Random Tower
    My Patreon

  30. 0
    Attack_Gypsy says:

    Strange. Should have accepted it then. Hrmm… There isn’t any limitations of the cash purchases. Store may have not accepted that type of card then.



    Yes, I am a liberal. I also believe in a strong military, less government, and the right to bear arms. ~ Me

  31. 0
    Attack_Gypsy says:

    He was probably getting cash as well and didn’t have enough. They use the same card for both. Believe it or not, the cards save them millions of dollars a year, just in printing costs.


  32. 0
    Attack_Gypsy says:

    Sorry, misread that as NCS, which is a credit card processing firm up here. NICS is the national background check.



    Yes, I am a liberal. I also believe in a strong military, less government, and the right to bear arms. ~ Me

  33. 0
    ZippyDSMlee says:

    Well those who get alil more tend to save or spend wisely, if they give moeny to the poor they will go out and blow it which will aid the economy.


    Then again they mgith also decide since youer check regulaer goverment check was stolen you got it so the 300 you got from them 3 months ago is now paid back twice to the goverment….. I so love goverment…..


    Gore,Violence,Sexauilty,Fear,Emotion these are but modes of transportation of story and thought, to take them from society you create a society of children and nannys, since adults are not required.

  34. 0
    LMLM says:

    GD86: More money on education doesn’t mean better education. It just means more money on education. More medical jobs doesn’t mean better health care, it just means more medical jobs. Money doesn’t solve all problems. I suggest you are avoiding the root cause of both problems by throwing money at them.

    The thinking that throwing money at problems solves them also ignores the basic fact that the money must come from somewhere. From where does it come? With the Federal Reserve system we have now, it means that this money comes from everyone who uses US dollars. So in essence, you are taking money from everyone. The money doesn’t come from a magic bag, it comes from diluting everyone else’s currency, or by taking a portion of their currency. What we are talking about is socialism. It is collectivism. It means that the needs of the many, outweigh the needs of the few, or the one. It means that the collective is more important than the individual. Socialism means that on an individual level, you are property of the collective. A degree of Economic slavery is what we are talking about. It means that the ends justify the means. Sacrifice today for tomorrow is what socialism is about. Tomorrow never comes as tomorrow, it only ever comes as today.

  35. 0
    Shadow D. Darkman says:

    Signed. Not saying which signature I am, though. 


    "Game on, brothers and sisters." -Leet Gamer Jargon

  36. 0
    GD86 says:

    The education spending is you improve american education you improve the number of people who can get higher level jobs.

    Heathcare spending means there is more medical jobs.

    The Broadband initiative gets techs in rural area jobs setting up the infrastructure and then helps set up for more internet business. Ditto for the bridges and other upgrades.

    The energy efficient upgrades mean there is less up keep so you can spend less later.

  37. 0
    ZippyDSMlee says:


    Uummm it gets people in jobs and gets taxes paid, what this dose is allow us to get by until we stabilize. Its like taking 2 crap ass jobs that don’t pay anything and strains your physical and mental condition to get out of debt at a later point in life, things suck now its better to do something than nothing…

    Gore,Violence,Sexauilty,Fear,Emotion these are but modes of transportation of story and thought, to take them from society you create a society of children and nannys, since adults are not required.

  38. 0
    deuxhero says:

    Uh what?


    Where do you think the money for the goverment jobs comes from…


    The tax payers! And who gets payed for these goverment jobs? The tax payers (well, people who should be tax payers, but are getting handouts from the goverment)! It doesn’t work…

  39. 0
    ZippyDSMlee says:

    Buracratic jobs are still jobs lulz, but the point of the mess is to create  "some" jobs by patting the big boys on the ehad and eltting them feel good enough about themselfs to exspand thier busniess insted of shriking it.


    But frankly…it would be cheaper to jsut give the popualce a check for 50-250 grand and be done with it….bypas the middle man thats been raping us all this time…..

    Gore,Violence,Sexauilty,Fear,Emotion these are but modes of transportation of story and thought, to take them from society you create a society of children and nannys, since adults are not required.

  40. 0
    Austin_Lewis says:

    How does it get people in jobs or get taxes paid?  It goes to the same groups in the government that continue to be blackholes for the taxpayer dollar!

  41. 0
    Austin_Lewis says:

    How is giving cars away at a lottery much better?  The government could use the cars for a million different things, and it would be stimulating the automobile industry.  Don’t give cars to people on the basis of a ‘golden ticket’.

  42. 0
    JustChris says:

    I would agree with at. As like with the auto industry, I’d even let the government buy a lot of the cars that the automakers have problems selling, and then give them for free to the everyday people, in a lottery drawing.


  43. 0
    Austin_Lewis says:

    Funny thing, the last bit of ‘economic stimulus’ we had, none of the money was passed down to the everyday person.  This is going to help no one except CEO’s. 

  44. 0
    Austin_Lewis says:

    I love how it phases out people starting in the middle class (middle class was defined as 70,000 a yr to 125,000 a yr).  Of course, I also love how, even though what I do has more effect on economy and I work harder than most people in that low income range, I get no tax cut.  Meanwhile, people who barely have an income (you know, those who work unskilled jobs like wal-mart or fast-food) get 500 back.  Yeah, fuck that.

    Same with the unemployment and ‘food stamp’ benefits.  In many states, the food stamp has been replaced with a Debit card that is accepted pretty much everywhere; I went to bass pro the other day to pick up a new $90 dollar harris bipod for a rifle, and watched a man try to buy a pistol with the EBT debit card.  Apparently, NICS denied him, but it still pissed me off.

    Also, free weatherization for moderate income homes, what the fuck.  Those people can afford to do it themselves.  If not, then they can waste more money on energy. 

    The $500 million for airport detectors is also a waste; the technology now is great.  What they need is people in the TSA who aren’t slow-witted. 

    And I think that 4.2 billion dollars for rehabilitating ‘foreclosed homes’ will end up going to inner cities, where it’ll make no difference, instead of to suburban areas which can suffer a worse crime rate because of the abandoned homes.

  45. 0
    Attack_Gypsy says:

    The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either. ~ Benjamin Franklin

     Edit: Hrmmm… lost my whole comment there… let me try again.


    There is no health benefits for the unemployed. That is to say, those collecting unemployment. You have to wait until your unemployment benefits are exhausted, then go on welfare and food stamps, before you can get health benefits.

    As much as people say welfare is a free ride, it isn’t. I’ve been on it. (About 10 years ago, when I first got sick) The entire process is humiliating. You have to tell them everything. You have NO privacy. You have to sell anything of any value you might have. I had a life insurance policy, so in case I died, my disabled wife was cared for for the rest of her life. They made me cash it in for a pitiful amount. This is what we got per month back then:

    Wife’s disability: 480.00 / month

    Welfare payment: 205.00 / month

    Food Stamps worth 225.00 / month


    Rent was 800.00 / month, never mind utilities and such. Thankfully, my parents owned the building so I could work off the extra rent and pay the utilities.


    Being on welfare sucks massively. Never mind just the stigma of being on it. it isn’t the freeloader’s handout people think it is.

  46. 0
    ZippyDSMlee says:


    Uhg..we need a overhaul of the edu system get rid of tenure for all non collage teachers, lower what aidmin can make and give teachers more if they are capable of teaching if they can not teach IE their classes have poor grades send them back to teaching school or fire them….

    School needs to be about results based on grades…..


    Gore,Violence,Sexauilty,Fear,Emotion these are but modes of transportation of story and thought, to take them from society you create a society of children and nannys, since adults are not required.

  47. 0
    TJLK says:

    Thanks for that article, having it available for everyone is a nice way to illustrate the general idea behind the stimulus package.  The inclusion of everything explains how little the package relates to games and gaming.

  48. 0
    Doomsong says:

    Thanks for that… very helpful.

    "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety" – Benjamin Franklin

  49. 0
    SlayDogg says:

    The following was taken from Yahoo:

    Your Paycheck

    What You’ll See:

    $145 billion in tax cuts for working individuals.

    The tax cut would be $500 per person ($1,000 for a couple) and would phase out for people making over $75,000 a year ($150,000 for couples). You can get the money either by claiming it on your tax return, or through a reduction in the taxes that are taken out of your weekly paycheck.

    This is the largest single measure in a tax package that includes additional cuts for businesses large and small, as well as expanded credits for low income individuals.

    For the Unemployed:

    $43 billion for increased unemployment benefits.

    $39 billion for expanded healthcare benefits for the unemployed.

    $20 billion to increase food stamp benefits.


    What You’ll See:

    $41 billion for school improvements, including better buildings, computer upgrades and teacher training.

    $15 billion to increase the maximum Pell grant by $500 in 2009-10; plus, increases to the annual unsubsidized Stafford Loan limits.

    $14 billion in tax credits of up to $2,500 a year for college students with an annual income below $80,000.

    $6 billion for college building improvements.

    Behind the Scenes:

    $79 billion to help states offset education costs. While people won’t see this directly, it will likely mean that services won’t have to be cut or taxes won’t have to be raised.

    Health Care

    What You’ll See:

    $4 billion for more preventative care programs.

    $1.5 billion for improvements at community health centers.

    Behind the Scenes:

    $20 billion to computerize health care records. This is intended primarily for doctors, although there’s some debate as to whether patients will have access to this database as well. Ultimately, it’s supposed to make the healthcare system more efficient and cheaper for everyone.

    $87 billion for states to help pay Medicaid costs. Again, while not directly visible to most people, state taxes would likely rise, or services cut, absent this measure.


    What You’ll See:

    $6 billion to weatherize moderate income homes, making them more energy efficient.

    $4 billion for homeowners to take up to 30% of the cost of conservation measures as a tax credit, up to $1,500 per person.

    $300 million for consumers to replace old appliances.

    $500 million to help rural families secure mortgages.

    For Those Living in Public Housing:

    $16 billion in energy retrofits and improvements.


    What You’ll See:

    $30 billion for highway and bridge construction projects.

    $10 billion for mass transit, including new lines, buses, trains and stations.

    $3 billion to expand congested airports.

    $1.15 billion for better land and sea ports.

    $4 billion for more police officers and equipment – best watch the speeding!

    $500 million for better airport screening detectors.

    Other Infrastructure Improvements

    What You’ll See:

    $31 billion to modernize public buildings, making them more energy efficient.

    $3.1 billion for improvements on public lands, including new roads, trails and facilities at national parks.

    $6 billion for broadband Internet access in rural areas.

    $400 million for flood control efforts, which include buying and preserving open land around the country.

    $6 billion for communities to replace aging sewer lines.

    $4.2 billion for towns to purchase and rehabilitate foreclosed, vacant homes.

    $32 billion for a "smart" utility grid and renewable energy production, although in the long run this could change the way you use appliances at home and clean the air.

    $10 billion for science research facilities.

    AE: No need to copy/paste the entire article.  Linking and summarizing the important points is sufficient.

  50. 0
    T5 says:

    I’m with you on this one jeff. The ECA increasingly looks like "The ends justify the means" group, not flaming, just remember this bill is about a heck of a lot more than the internet. The ECA’s stated goals can be solved without increasing the already bloated government.  

  51. 0
    the1jeffy says:

    Even as a fellow ECA member, I HIGHLY reccommend looking at all aspects of this stimulus before blindly following the ECA’s lead. 

    Sure, the broadband initiative and net nuetrality are superficially good for gamers, the methods that are currently on the table for doing so leave something to be desired.

    Please do your research before you follow the crowd and get on board with this plan.  Political party doesn’t matter, all government actions need to be under fierce scrutiny.  Obama shouldn’t get carte blanche approval just because he’s new and not GW.  Watch what he does first, then give him your support (just like you should with any governmental body).

    ~~All Knowledge is Worth Having~~

  52. 0
    Brett Schenker says:

    The purpose of this action is really simple – to make sure Net Neutrality and Broadband expansion are part of the stimulus package.  Whether you agree or disagree with the stimulus package as a whole – and I note that the ECA isn’t taking a position on the entire package – these are provisions that many ECA members and supporters have been fighting for, for close to a year now.  There are folks who are trying to strip ou or water down these provisions, and we’re providing our voice to make sure they remain.

    This isn’t a Red, Blue, or Purple issue or about whether we agree or disagree with the stimulus package.  This is about Net Neutrality and Broadband expansion.

    Brett Schenker

    Online Advocacy Manager

    the ECA

  53. 0
    TJLK says:

    Even if I agreed with Universal Broadband and Net Neutrality I wouldn’t be so irresponsible to say you should agree with this stimulus package just for those reasons.  Most of the stimulus package has NOTHING TO DO WITH GAMES.  I agree with the1jeffy on his suggestion to do research.  I’m a dedicated ECA member but this stimulus package A.) Has too little to do with gaming and B.)Too much to do with everything besides gaming.

    What happened to having a moderate stance on issues?

  54. 0
    nighstalker160 says:

    The Democrats (specifically Obama’s) stimulas package WOULD take a while to be effective. The issue is that the Republicans plan, while effective in the short term is not long lasting.

    Basically the Republican plan is to help NOW but then stop helping.

    The Democrats plan is to help LATER but have more sustained help.

    IMO you need to combine the two, have some short-term initiatives combined with the long term plans.

    Plus the Obama plan involves MASSIVE infrastructure projects, rebuilding the interstates, rebuilding bridges, power grid upgrades, broadband extension etc. Obviously that is really expensive, but the U.S. lags so far behind in some of those areas I think its worth it. Plus you’re talking about a lot of jobs (from the engineers and computer guys to design and plot the roadways down to the guy laying down asphalt.)

    At the same time I do think you want some immediate injections and bumps into the economy that come out of the Republican package.

    It’s a tough issue though because the Republic package requires spending CUTS while the Democrat’s package requires spending increases.

    Bottom line is that this economy is a wreck and needs some maintainence that goes WAY beyond partisan posturing. Unfortunately, the politicans are in charge of fixing it.

  55. 0
    suvachi says:

    i heard that universal broadband would take several years to go into effect and therefore would do nothing to stimulate our economy immediately.  or was I listening to right wing banter?  as well is there somewhere I can see all of the proposals in the stimulus package?  as much as I love gaming I think it’s be shortminded of me to support it off of this alone 😉

  56. 0
    E. Zachary Knight says:

    Universal broadband is not really government providing internet to every one. It is the government providing incentives for large scale ISPs to stretch out away for the high polulation density areas they currently reside and branching out to smaller rural areas that don’t have such high density.

    Basically they are providing incentives to set up shop in places that have fewer than 20,000 people living in it. Like my home town of 10,000 which currently has only one over priced, under delivered DSL provider.

    E. Zachary Knight
    Oklahoma City Chapter of the ECA

    E. Zachary Knight
    Divine Knight Gaming
    Oklahoma Game Development
    Rusty Outlook
    Random Tower
    My Patreon

  57. 0
    Alteffor says:

    Net neutrality I support completely. However, universal broadband provided by the government really isn’t financially feasible at the moment. Sure it’d be awesome for bringing poorer gamers in to play games with the rest of us but thats really just a big luxury, and that’s not something that can be afforded right now.

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