Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling on California Video Game Law; Urges SCOTUS Appeal

February 23, 2009 -

As GamePolitics reported on Friday, the 9th U.S. Circuit Court has upheld a lower court's ruling that California's 2005 video law is unconstitutional.

The Parents Television Council has now weighed in on the decision. The Los Angeles-based watchdog group criticized the 9th Circuit's ruling and called upon PTC members to support State Sen. Leland Yee's call for an appeal to the U.S. Supreme Court.

In a press release, PTC President Tim Winter (left) said:

Let’s be clear on what – exactly – is going on here: The video game industry has established a policy to ‘protect’ children from a harmful product, yet they file lawsuit after lawsuit to oppose any enforcement of that same policy... The only motivation for the industry to sue is to keep collecting blood money from kids who aren’t supposed to be able to buy these games without their parents present at the time of purchase.

There are very responsible retailers out there – Wal-Mart and Game Stop come to mind – who take their obligation not to sell these games to kids very seriously.  Yet industry representatives claim this law is unfairly biased against them... If the industry actually followed its own rules, then this law would have absolutely no financial impact... 

Shockingly, the Court’s ruling claims that there isn’t enough research to support that children are affected by video game violence.  Yet countless independent studies confirm what most parents instinctively know to be true: repeated exposure to graphic sexual, violent and profanity-laced video games has a harmful and long-term effect on children...
This federal court decision is a disgrace and should be of great concern to all parents – not just in California but across our nation.  We applaud State Sen. Yee’s efforts to see that this decision goes to the U.S. Supreme Court...


Comments

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

The games industry (ESA) has been and seemingly continues to be run by spineless wimps.  Vince McMahon, love him or hate him, at least had the testicular fortitude to go after the PTC for their lies.

Would Mr. Gallagher ever dream of going Vince McMachon on the PTC?  Doubtful.   The ESA seems to think mod chips are a bigger threat to the industry than groups intent on regulating/banning their wares.

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

These pigs are such hypocrites and the people like them. They want their freedoms and rights respected and protected but heaven forbid if they grant that same respect to everyone else.

"With free speech either all of it is ok or none of it is." Kyle Broflovski

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

The PTC assumes that the because the law they want to enact is "intended" to protect the children, that alone should be enough to enact a law. It's sad really. They're blinded by this so-called noble cause to protect the children that they are willing to sacrifice certain liberties.

None of the studies they mention prove a causal link between playing violent video games and actual violent behavior.

"repeated exposure to graphic sexual, violent and profanity-laced video games has a harmful and long-term effect on children.  Researchers at the Indiana University School of Medicine – and countless other objective studies – have  proven violent video games do have an effect by using functional magnetic resonance imaging technology to observe which areas of the brain are stimulated when a subject plays violent video games."

It's odd. They say it has a harmful negative long-term effect on children. This is obviously misleading. And what are these harmful effects? It's so vague, it's almost funny. Here's their argument in a nutshell:

Them: Violent Video games are bad.

Us: Why?

Them: Isn't it obvious?

Us: No

Them: It harmfully affects them.

Us: How?

Them: You see this brain scan. Yea. This area was stimulated. It should never be stimulated. It's a bad part of the brain. Good children never have this area stimulated...

I wonder if that part of the brain gets stimulated when we play, say... pokemon. Or Zelda, Mario, Sonic, Mario Kart. They all involve some sort of violent attack behavior against another. What about fighting games such as street fighter, Smash Bros, or even Tekken. I wonder if they've done a study on that.

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

The PTC never EVER follows thier Rules, They're total hypocrites (like the AFA and Morality in Media) one minute they want to help the children, the next minute they want to badmouth Socitey as we now it

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parents_Television_Council

 

Watching JT on GP is just like watching an episode of Jerry springer only as funny as the fights

America has just became its own version of the Jerry Springer Show after a bizarre moment in Florida involving a carnival worker.

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

The bigger question should be "How are "kids" getting money to buy these games much less get to the store to buy them?" (short of being 16 + and has a car/job)

If we are trying to "protect the children", should we not also rate the bible, koran, etc as "AO" since they have been used to support violence and other crimes, so that kids are not corrupted?

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

For those interested, the NYC Council's webpage is

http://council.nyc.gov/html/home/home.shtml

They actually have a link on the side to "let them know" if you see RapeLay being sold.

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

Bla bla bla. Another Faith-Oriented group gets upset that they can't destroy the First Amendment in the name of "the children" and "families". 

If the Christian Right was so dedicated to "families", why are so many more of them breaking due to divorce than non-religious families?

 

Scumbags.

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

Heh.

One of the reasons the divorce rate is so high is it is getting harder and harder for the christian right communities to hide the abuse that goes on in thier households.

Over the decades the community has tried to shift the image of abuse to anyone other then themselves... gays, polys, feminists, satanists, atheists, etc etc etc.  This has made it easier to write off thier own abuse.  I've honestly heard pedophiles who have been raping their own daughters claim with a strait (and possibly even they believe it) face that they are not pedophiles because they are not gay, and poof, everyone ignores the incest and rape going on.

So today, you've got a male population in the community that doesn't want to change, but a female population that is starting to figure out that they don't HAVE to sit and take it (even though divorce often results in the woman being ostrasized) and thus have other options.

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

Do you happen to know anything about the Christian right? They're not a bunch of woman-beating chauvinists; those are only the crazy ones who go start their own little communes with an entire arsenal stashed in the basement (and even here I'm making an unfair generalization; some of those commune people could be completely sane and rather nice). You're talking about the extreme right loonies; they're no better representatives of Christianity and the moderate Christian right than Islamic terrorists are of Islam.

If you want a reason for divorce rates, try this one out. What you have in Christianity today is a conflict between Christian values and secular ideas about sex. People get into irresponsible physical relationships, and she gets pregnant. Since they're Christians (or at least claim to be), they'll likely get married. But, since they're also probably not ready for children or being married, the marriage ends in divorce. The higher divorce rate could stem from women who would otherwise be single mothers getting married because they feel it's the right thing to do and then realizing that they're really not compatible with the child's father.

No matter which option they pick, the women generally aren't ostracized. After the initial rumor flurry gets around all the church's old ladies, the church settles back down and doesn't make a big deal out of the divorced/single mother. Heck, there's a good chance they'll work out some way for her to get help from the rest of the church such as taking hand-me-down baby stuff that she'd otherwise have trouble affording.

I have friends whose parents have gone through this exact sequence of events, and I've never met any Christian couple who got divorced because the woman felt like she was being oppressed. Don't jump to stupid conclusions like "Christians have high divorce rates because they're chauvinists" without some sort of proof that actually represents more than a small group of nuts.

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

Beacuse the christian-right blames the non-religious and the homosexuals for that divorce rate and other marriage troubles? //boggle

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

* except in California and ... Utah, is it? I'm still beyond disgusted that prop 8 passed. >.<;

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Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

I'm more upset over the millions of dollars being wasted to fund these for/against campaigns.

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

Amen (I'll probably be struck by lightning for using that word).

I'm a California resident, and it really pisses me off that in a state with a $42 BILLION deficit (that's Billion, with a "B") where education cost-cutting is rampant, Yee and the PTC feel that their claptrap should take priority over sending our kids to decent schools.  I'm so mad about this I could crap a copy of GTA-4.  I've written Yee and told him something similar (in a much more politic voice, for sure).  Have yet to hear back.

I've seen a few references to higher divorce rates among the uber-religious.  What blows me away is how ready the ultra-right-wing-religious-"save-the-kids!"-mouthpieces are to lie and deceive as a means to their ends.  I'm not a religious guy, but among things that most religions decry, isn't lying one of the real bad ones? 

What blows me away more is how many people actually believe their lies.

***Homicide-free video gaming since 1972!***

***Homicide-free video gaming since 1972!***

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

We are not hypocrites. We don't don't want the landslide effect.  Also, how many of those countless independent studies hasn't been disproved. Most of them are theoretical anyway. There like the study of dinosaurs are made of wood. Why? Because they are brown, and wood is brown, therefore, dinosaurs are made of wood.

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

Dinosaurs are witches! Burn them! (Monty Python reference about wood).

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

You know, once...I was turned into a newt.

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

I take it you got better?

---
The Mammon Industry

---
Fangamer

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling on

Does anyone hate that dudes face as much as I do?

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

Looks like a high Jeff Daniels.

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

looks like a zombie

There have always been motherf*ckers, there will always be motherf*ckers, but what we can't do is let them control our motherf*cking lives. -John Oliver, December 1st, 2008

There have always been motherf*ckers, there will always be motherf*ckers, but what we can't do is let them control our motherf*cking lives. -John Oliver, December 1st, 2008

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

"The video game industry has established a policy to ‘protect’ children from a harmful product..."

No it has not.  Please try to understand what the ESRB ratings are actually meant to do.  Here, this might help.

"And they base their legal argument on a child’s ‘right’ to purchase the very product that they openly admit should not be purchased by a child."

Sorry PTC but like it or not, children have rights too.  The industry isn't saying children shouldn't purchase these products.  It's saying that games with an M-rating are not recommended for children under 17.

"...the result is a tragic consequence on America’s children."

Care to elaborate?

"How does the video game industry even have legal standing to sue on behalf of children who wouldn’t be able to pay them for the very products they admit that kids shouldn’t be buying?"

Huh?  If kids aren't able to pay for them, why is this even an issue?  Why are you supporting legislation preventing kids from doing something you claim they can't do anyway?

"The only motivation for the industry to sue is to keep collecting blood money from kids..."

Blood money?  Care to elaborate?

"If the industry actually followed its own rules, then this law would have absolutely no financial impact whatsoever on the industry."

I take it you've never heard of the concept of chilled speech?

"...repeated exposure to graphic sexual, violent and profanity-laced video games has a harmful and long-term effect on children."

No it doesn't.  Try reading the actual studies.  As for the Indiana study, it used an MRI to look at the difference between the brains of normal kids and kids with disruptive behavioral disorders when playing violent games.  The conclusion: kids with DBD have less activity going on in the frontal lobe (decision-making and behavioral control) then kids without DBD when playing violent games.  The games used?  A racing game and a James Bond game.

That in no way proves harm.

 

Andrew Eisen

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

A brilliant dissection of their flawed argument.

Unfortunately, I have come to the rather pessimistic conclusion that even if they do realise that they don't have a coherent argument they still wouldn't care as they have a vested interest opposing this supposed "moral backslide" etc.

I'm seriously considering starting my own decency campaign and charging people for joining. I will simply check GP and game news sites to see which games are popular, stage large internet protests about said games, rack up page views and paste the pages with ads. Hell, throw in a donation link to help "fight against immorality" and I'll be set.

Maybe I'll be able to buy a new 360 to replace my rrod'd one since MS seem to have lost it somewhere in the post (seriously, how long does it take them to repair them? Not to put to fine a point on it, but you think they'd have had a bit of pratice by now!).

-ConstantNeophyte: always the newb, ALWAYS.

-ConstantNeophyte: always the newb, ALWAYS.

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

"How does the video game industry even have legal standing to sue on behalf of children who wouldn’t be able to pay them for the very products they admit that kids shouldn’t be buying?"

Huh?  If kids aren't able to pay for them, why is this even an issue?  Why are you supporting legislation preventing kids from doing something you claim they can't do anyway?

that alone FTW

岩「…Where do masochists go when they die?」

岩「…I can see why Hasselbeck's worried about fake guns killing fake people. afterall, she's a fake journalist on a fake news channel」

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

Great breakdown of their arguments!

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

'Shockingly, the Court’s ruling claims that there isn’t enough research to support that children are affected by video game violence.  Yet countless independent studies confirm what most parents instinctively know to be true: repeated exposure to graphic sexual, violent and profanity-laced video games has a harmful and long-term effect on children.'

Amazing, simply amazing, could they stretch that just a little further, possibly to include martians?

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

"Shockingly, the Court’s ruling claims that there isn’t enough research to support that children are affected by video game violence.  Yet countless independent studies confirm what most parents instinctively know to be true: repeated exposure to graphic sexual, violent and profanity-laced video games has a harmful and long-term effect on children."

Y'know, after the FTC came out with their findings that the PTC didn't agree with, they made their own study, which had the results they wanted?

Replace independent with PTC

'Shockingly, the Court’s ruling claims that there isn’t enough research to support that children are affected by video game violence.  Yet countless PTC studies confirm what most parents instinctively know to be true: repeated exposure to graphic sexual, violent and profanity-laced video games has a harmful and long-term effect on children.'

Makes sense, right?

 - Warren Lewis

Consumer responsibility is just as important as Corporate responsibility.

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling on

Let’s be clear on what – exactly – is going on here: The video game industry has established a policy to ‘protect’ children from a harmful product, yet they file lawsuit after lawsuit to oppose any enforcement of that same policy.

Let's be informed about what we're talking about. The video game industry has established a set of guidelines to allow parents to better judge what their kids should and should not be playing, yet morons like the PTC seem to think that suggestions carry some sort of legal weight and that the industry and retailers are responsible for making sure children can't buy things that aren't suggested for them. It's not their problem if parents can't control their children and keep track of what they buy.

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling on

Took the words out of my mouth!

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

"The most difficult pain a man can suffer is to have knowledge of much and power over little" - Herodotus

--------------------------------------------------------------------------- "The most difficult pain a man can suffer is to have knowledge of much and power over little" - Herodotus

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling on

Secondly, it protects the rights of Adult players who want to play games that would not be made if they could not get funding because "only E for everyone" games sell (just one example)

This is exactly what the First Amendment is about.  By restricting speech in any way, you censor it.

------- Morality has always been in decline. As you get older, you notice it. When you were younger, you enjoyed it.

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling on

Oh jeez.  Kiss my ass PTC.  You coddle children too much and what do you get?  A neurotic adult unable to deal with the realties of the world.

This whole "For the children!" crusade has screwed up a large portion of my generation. 

 

Tea and cake or death! Tea and cake or death! Little Red Cook-book! Little Red Cook-book!

Tea and cake or death! Tea and cake or death! Little Red Cook-book! Little Red Cook-book!

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

:P  Silly rabbits at the PTC certainly love to moo.

Re: Parents Television Council Assails Federal Court Ruling ...

This guy does not understand the slippery slope concept I guess.

Banana

Quack

Nido Web Flash Tutorials AS2 and AS3 Tutorials for anyone interested.
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Matthew Wilsonthe lose of nn would not be good for us, but it will not be good for verizion/comcast/att in the long run ether.04/24/2014 - 2:16pm
Matthew Wilsonsadly yes. it would take another sopa day to achieve it.04/24/2014 - 2:13pm
NeenekoI am also confused. Are you saying NN would only become law if Google/Netflix pushed the issue (against their own interests)?04/24/2014 - 2:10pm
E. Zachary KnightMatthew, you are saying a lot of things but I am still unclear on your point. Are you saying that the loss of Net Neutrality will be good in the long run?04/24/2014 - 2:06pm
Matthew WilsonOfcourse it does I never said it did not.though over time the death of NN will make backbone providers like Google, level3 and others stronger becouse most isps including the big ones can not provid internet without them. they can peer with smaller isps04/24/2014 - 1:54pm
E. Zachary KnightMatthew, and that still plays in Google's favor over their smaller rivals who don't have the muscle to stand up to ISPs.04/24/2014 - 1:45pm
Matthew Wilsongoogle wont pay becouse they control a large part of the backbone that all isps depend on. if verizon blocks their data, google does the same. the effect is Verizon loses access to 40% of the internet, and can not serve some areas at all.04/24/2014 - 1:14pm
Neenekolack of NN is in google and netflix interest. It is another tool for squeezing out smaller companies since they can afford to 'play'04/24/2014 - 12:57pm
Matthew WilsonI have said it before net nutrality will not be made in to law until Google or Netflix is blocked, or they do what they did for sopa and pull their sites down in protest.04/23/2014 - 8:02pm
Andrew EisenGee, I guess putting a former cable industry lobbyist as the Chairman of the FCC wasn't that great of an idea. http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/24/technology/fcc-new-net-neutrality-rules.html?_r=204/23/2014 - 7:26pm
Andrew EisenIanC - I assume what he's getting at is the fact that once PS3/360 development ceases, there will be no more "For Everything But Wii U" games.04/23/2014 - 5:49pm
Andrew EisenMatthew - Yes, obviously developers will eventually move on from the PS3 and 360 but the phrase will continue to mean exactly what it means.04/23/2014 - 5:45pm
IanCAnd how does that equal his annoying phrase being meaningless?04/23/2014 - 5:09pm
Matthew Wilson@Andrew Eisen the phrase everything but wiiu will be meaningless afer this year becouse devs will drop 360/ps3 support.04/23/2014 - 4:43pm
Andrew EisenFor Everything But... 360? Huh, not many games can claim that title. Only three others that I know of.04/23/2014 - 3:45pm
MaskedPixelantehttp://www.joystiq.com/2014/04/23/another-world-rated-for-current-consoles-handhelds-in-germany/ Another World fulfills legal obligations of being on every gaming system under the sun.04/23/2014 - 12:34pm
Matthew Wilsonhttp://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/04/steam-gauge-do-strong-reviews-lead-to-stronger-sales-on-steam/?comments=1 Here is another data driven article using sales data from steam to figure out if reviews effect sales. It is stats heavy like the last one.04/23/2014 - 11:33am
Andrew EisenI love RPGs but I didn't much care for Tales of Symphonia. I didn't bother with its sequel.04/23/2014 - 11:21am
InfophileIt had great RPGs because MS wanted to use them to break into Japan. (Which had the side-effect of screwing NA PS3 owners out of Tales of Vesperia. No, I'm not bitter, why do you ask?)04/23/2014 - 10:52am
RedMageI'm still disappointed the 360 never broke into Japan either. It had a bevy of great RPGs in the late 2000s.04/23/2014 - 9:48am
 

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