Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

March 17, 2009 -

Rep. Mike Morley (R) of the Utah House of Representatieves is apparently getting a lot of e-mail from gamers.

They're not happy.

Morley, of course is the sponsor of HB 353, the Jack Thompson-conceived video game/movie rating enforcment bill which passed overwhelmingly in both the Utah House and Senate.

The Deseret News reports that "various groups" are e-mailing Morley. The legislator told the newspaper:

I was told that there might be some crazies out there... I actually talked to some of these people who sent me crazy e-mails (from Facebook), and everyone one I talked to, after I explained the bill and asked them to read it, didn't think that it would do [what various Web sites said it would]...

 

This is not the end of the world for video-game sales," Morley says. "We are not creating a litigious situation. No one should be concerned.

HB 353 is now before Utah Gov. Jon Huntsman (R), who has 20 days (from March 12th) to sign the bill into law or veto it.

GP: It seems likely that the Guv will sign HB 353 into law. After that, the next move will be up to the ESA (publishers) and EMA (retailers). Will they pursue a federal court solution? That's unclear at this point because HB 353 is a different kind of animal than previous legislative efforts aimed at video games.


Comments

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

"I was told that there might be some crazies out there... "

And I'm sure David Duke will tell you there are crazy "black people" out there and Fred Phelps will tell you that homosexuals will rape you if you go against them, but Duke and Phelps are just as crazy as, if not significantly more so, the people who they are 'warning" you about.  Just as I am sure those who are "warning" you about the crazy gamers (and I have no doubt as to who one of those individuals, who HAS shown a great deal of mental, moral, and ethical instability on a number of occassions.

You might want to link the activities of some nutjob individuals to certain groups, but rest assured, when certain groups of individuals start acting certain ways, I WON'T be linking them to YOU just because you may share something in common with THEM.  Isn't that ever so nice of me?

Nightwng2000

NW2K Software

Nightwng2000 has also updated his MySpace page: http://www.myspace.com/nightwing2000 Nightwng2000 is now admin to the group "Parents For Education, Not Legislation" on MySpace as http://groups.myspace.com/pfenl

Nightwng2000 NW2K Software http://www.facebook.com/nightwing2000 Nightwng2000 is now admin to the group "Parents For Education, Not Legislation" on MySpace as http://groups.myspace.com/pfenl

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

Does not surprize me that some politicians only take notice from angry gamers instead of the more intelligent informed gamers.

It is basicly a politician's job to lie or try to only pick out the bad examples to try and make their point stronger.

If they get away with it, most likely they do because the mainstreem media is surely not going to take the side of gamers unless if some gamers are going to act like little kids that the politicians make us all out to be.

 

So yeah, instead of writing to him, just not write anything to him.

If you point out all the lies that the Eagle Forum has used to market this bill to the senate, then it will be obvious that this guy will never listen, so you need to do it more pro-active and send your emails to the people who are going to vote on this, and let them know of our information so THEY can be more informed about what is really going on with this bill.

 

 

TBoneTony

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

Looking at the comments on Deseret news, most of the people believe it will never work

Watching JT on GP is just like watching an episode of Jerry springer only as funny as the fights

America has just became its own version of the Jerry Springer Show after a bizarre moment in Florida involving a carnival worker.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

I think (in addition of Utah acting like Zelots) We're also acting like them, We've Got to stop and think was it rally right for some gamers to call Morley a moron(He did say the bill was exactly as toothless(which is also worthless))

Watching JT on GP is just like watching an episode of Jerry springer only as funny as the fights

America has just became its own version of the Jerry Springer Show after a bizarre moment in Florida involving a carnival worker.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

I wonder if I have been exposed to JBT to much, I am starting to see conspiracies. 

Maybe we (and the world at large or at least those that care) have it all wrong.  It is not in the hands of Rep. Morley or jackie or even the Governer.  The true evil (the Sith behind the scenes acting in plain sight as it were) is the Eagle Forums.  jackie was/is the showhorse that was proped up to introduce the bill, I submit his total lack of presence since then, normally jackie would be crowing from the highest mountains about how great he is and how he had won (while plugging his book) as evidence, Morley was "encouraged" to propose it and to be the talking head (its all fine, nothing to worry about, "Nothing to see here move along") and public face.  He was basically tossed out like a naked baby in the forest during bear hunting season, maybe as a distraction. 

Even if PHX was someone able to convince Mr Morley of the wrongness of his position (highly doubtful) the impact on the bill at this point would still be virtually none. 

Sigh, really need to stop overanalyzing things

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

"I was told that there might be some crazies out there..."

Too bad you weren't told this before you decided to sponsor this bill. Had you been alerted to one particular crazy, this bill might never have seen the light of day.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

After reading some of the responses on the Desert News site to the article, I know it will pass as quite a few comments where about "Thank goodness we can save the children now". 

The article does state that UTAH has a 94% of stopping sales to minors of M games. So I guess this law was to stop the other 6%?

 

Waste of tax payers money to me...

Trevor Gray
ganjookie@yahoo.com

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

This is the Email that i intend to send mike morely(some sections are censored)

-Snipped-  I'm concerned by statements that some gamers made about you, after what happened a few gamers rushed to your defense

The reason why I'm emailing you is not because but to show you some of the Responses that some GP(Gamepolitics.com) members feel bad for what happened

this message points out by Icehawk says it's natural for people(gamers in General) to act like this(snipped it for time)

The people (again gamers and those related) do have cause to be upset I think, and attempting to get answers from the sponsor of the offending bill is only natural.  (If you want the full comment(and to comment about what happened), I'm leaving a link to GP -snipped-)

This also leads me to a similar situation where AIG was threatened by it's customers(and one federal senator)

-SNIPPED-
(Note: Due to fear of statements(made in this article) I left a link to an article instead)

 

Watching JT on GP is just like watching an episode of Jerry springer only as funny as the fights

America has just became its own version of the Jerry Springer Show after a bizarre moment in Florida involving a carnival worker.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

Feel use to quote me, snip, Copy and paste.  I personally would like to see posted here on GP what Mr Morley beleives the bill is acutally supposed to do (our apparent misunderstanding that he claimed he was trying to correct) and its expected impact.  Democracy, gotta love it. 

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

once he responds to me, i'll post it right away in the comments section or Give it to dennis

Watching JT on GP is just like watching an episode of Jerry springer only as funny as the fights

America has just became its own version of the Jerry Springer Show after a bizarre moment in Florida involving a carnival worker.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

Ugh this is is really sad from both sides, I have seen comments posted on here by gamers that make me ashamed to be part of the group. This guy hasn't said anything as offensive as jack thompson did, but I know there are people sending him death threats and the like, yeah that really makes us look mature. It basically reinforces their view that we're a group of immature violent kids.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

I can understand what you are saying but there are levels to this.  Yes it was a kneejerk reaction and I could easily see those threatening or leet speak insulting (hoping against the more graphically vulgar and death threats) emails that are not particually helpful on the behalf of gamers whereas we also have a State representive calling people (gamers) crazies in a public forum and apparently even before the emails began.  The people (again gamers and those related) do have cause to be upset I think, and attempting to get answers from the sponsor of the offending bill is only natural.  

 

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

you think that's worse, Try people sending death threats to AIG(and a senator calling AIG to resign or Commit Sucide)

Watching JT on GP is just like watching an episode of Jerry springer only as funny as the fights

America has just became its own version of the Jerry Springer Show after a bizarre moment in Florida involving a carnival worker.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

I found his email address, I'm going to tell him why Jackiepoo cause more anger and hate by showing him the infractions that he caused(through GP and some sites of course) if he knew what the moron did, then he may see the light

If Morely knows the truth, then he'll See what we are fighting against

Watching JT on GP is just like watching an episode of Jerry springer only as funny as the fights

America has just became its own version of the Jerry Springer Show after a bizarre moment in Florida involving a carnival worker.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

Pointing out the long trail of bullshit and mistakes of the walking Fail that is known as jackie is not much of a effort, not likely to help much either I think.  Its The Eagle Forum that is pulling the strings here, think jackie was brought onboard more as a showpony.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

yeah, your right trying to reason with mike morely would be a bad idea

Watching JT on GP is just like watching an episode of Jerry springer only as funny as the fights

America has just became its own version of the Jerry Springer Show after a bizarre moment in Florida involving a carnival worker.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

but at least it's better than flaming him

岩「…Where do masochists go when they die?」

岩「…I can see why Hasselbeck's worried about fake guns killing fake people. afterall, she's a fake journalist on a fake news channel」

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

Ok, I'll email him Trying to reason with him

Watching JT on GP is just like watching an episode of Jerry springer only as funny as the fights

America has just became its own version of the Jerry Springer Show after a bizarre moment in Florida involving a carnival worker.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

In Morley's defense, he probably got some pretty bad emails.  It's frustrating because I'm a UT resident and I sent emails to Morley and my local rep asking them not to move forward with this bill and I picture my emails getting lost in an ocean of, "zOmG ur 4 FUk3r!!!"  Of course there's the chance that every email he got was a well thought out critque of the bill.  This being the internet and all I somehow doubt that's what happened.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

 Some crazies ... you know people who don't immeditly agree with the government on everything and god forbid don't worship the ground we walk on.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

 was told that there might be some crazies out there... I actually talked to some of these people who sent me crazy e-mails (from Facebook), and everyone one I talked to, after I explained the bill and asked them to read it, didn't think that it would do [what various Web sites said it would]

 

Well, If were Crazy?, How come some of us "Crazies" Have college degrees,Higher-paying jobs and family and well to say...A BETTER intelligence than you, Hmmm, As i recall the utah board has a crazy in their office who's goal is to irradicate the things we love by doing his usual lie,cheat,steal tatics,Not to mention...Again That Jack Thompson Know's himself that the politicians he has caught in his net, (Including the guv) Has no idea what HB 353's real possible purpose is.

Magic Taco

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

" . . . . HB 353 is a different kind of animal than previous legislative efforts aimed at video games."

But none the less a crippled gazelle for hungry lions if challenged in federal court.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

I would say to write Utah Gov. Jon Huntsman and voice our concerns.  I won't post his contact info (as it will surely get banned) but just google Utah Gov. Jon Huntsman and you'll find it

Sortableturnip's Law: As an online discussion of video game violence grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Jack Thompson approaches 1

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

I was told that there might be some crazies out there...

You were told that BY a crazy.  Can't you tell?  Nope, I guess not.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

This is not the end of the world for video-game sales," Morley says. "We are not creating a litigious situation. No one should be concerned.

So if it is not a litigious situation then why are you trying to pass a law?  Putting aside my natural aversion that I have to all things jack thompson I am still concerned at the all but transparent lie.   Have to wonder if Mr Morley lives in the same world as the rest of us (or is he an immigrant from jackies bizzaro world?) that he is suprised that he is receiving email from gamers.  So he calls us crazies?  What next back to the "all gamers are terrorists" arguement of years gone by?

btw It is very wise of you (from what appears otherwise to be a weak and foolish man) not to attempt to stop all video game sales as they are solid taxable income for your state.   You sir are the reason I dislike and often distrust politicians. 
 

 

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

Considering the bill comes from extremist Christian scum, and Jack Thompson (the biggest extremist Christian scum of them all), how can anyone think it isn't meant to create litigious situations? 

- Jack Thompson has said repeadedly his intent to sue game makers until it becomes too troublesome to even make games for adults. 

- The Christian right has a shameful track record of trying to use the law to legislate their flawed sense of morality. 

You need to look at who created and pushed this bill to determine what the intent is. 

 

Oh, and scumbag politicians (name one who isn't) like Mike Morley need to realize that people who play games can hardly be called "crazies" anymore.  They are called VOTERS.  I guess that might be too much for someone who thinks an old man sitting in a cloud is watching him- waiting to punish him for doing something "immoral".  Scumbag.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

So, I'm going to assume by your condescending post that you've only become active in politics in the past 8 years. I can't remember the congressional majorities of the Clinton administration, but throughout Bush's time in office, and into Obama's reign, the majority of legislators have been democrats.

I'm sorry, I believe that I'm accountable for my own actions here on Earth and that a higher power will hold me accountable. I also believe that the same power is what created this earth and humanity. Meaning this same power is responsible for, to use big words for goofy things, flatulance, intercourse, and other potentially silly bodily functions.

Thompson is too focused on the punitive aspects of his religion to understand that this is the same God, according to his religion, responsible for giving each of us a sense of humor. If he believes that God is up there with his smite-stick waiting for people to mess up, he's sorely mistaken.

There is one thing that, in the Christian religion, every Christian will confess to believing their God will say to them. That thing is this : "You were wrong".

All of this said, I'd appreciate it if you were less condescending about Thompson's Christianity-as there are other Christians on this site, and they're sane enough to feel offended when people are nasty about their beliefs.

 

I will not buy securom games. http://www.wolvenmoon.com/sharedfiles/message1.jpg and http://www.wolvenmoon.com/sharedfiles/message2.jpg

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

You stated:

 "but throughout Bush's time in office, and into Obama's reign, the majority of legislators have been democrats."

You obviously have only gotten into politics in the last 3 years.

The Republicans took control of Congress in 1994, just 2 years after Clinton took office.  They held that majority in the House of Representatives and a slim majority in the Sentate until 2006 when the Democrats took control of both the Senate and the House.   Now taking that Clinton was in office from 1993 until 2001 he dealt with a Republican Congress the majority of his term.   Bush also had a Republican Congress for 6 of his 8 years in Office, hardly Democrats in control throughout Bush's term.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

He's talking about politicians who have brought forth video game legislation, most of which have been Democrats not who has been in control of the House and Senate. Same deal with the whole Tipper Gore and Co. Back in the 80s with music.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

If they're extremist scum and extremist christians, then technically they ARE extremist christian scum. So state the hard laws of logic.

While the language is rough, the poster gives no indication to actually go against all of Christianity or Christians in general, they seem to be mainly aimed at the extremistic ones with very limited, twisted, views.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

First, thank you to all three of you for understanding that not all Christians are the likes of Jack Thompson. While I share his faith, I find Thompson's behavior appalling as well, and have no problems hearing him called an extremist.

However, regarding the politicians being "scumbags" for trying to bend law to their will... well, that's kind of their job. Regardless of whether you hate what they do or not, that's what they're elected to do.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

lol not really man, since when were politicians meant to make laws to tailor to their own personal agendas...

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

"We are not creating a litigious situation. No one should be concerned."

 

Well ,that shows one thing ,he really doesn't know who he's working with on this.

Thompson wants the end of videos games, and he wants the industry to get so buried in lawsuits that makign anythign above E is too risky.

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

I still fail to understand how you can enforce something that is voluntary.

Praetorian

"I've been told I'm the resident skeptic, but I wouldn't believe that."

http://www.myspace.com/pree_tawr_ee_uhn



Praetorian

"If you sit by the river long enough, you will see the body of your enemy floating by."

http://www.myspace.com/pree_tawr_ee_uhn

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

Really?  It doesn't do what we think it does?  Because it sounds like you are trying to, through underhanded and dubious means to try and circumvent Constitutional issues, to place force of law behind voluntary systems.  And therefore increasing the meddling of the Government in our personal lives.

-Ultimately what will do in mankind is a person's fear of their own freedom-

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

Copying my comment from gameslaw.net because I'm too lazy to repeat myself:

Correct me if I’m wrong, but is this regulation even enforceable? After reading the entire truth in advertising chapter of title 13 I’m just not sure how any government body could reasonably believe that this law will be in any way effective.

1) An advertisement is defined as “any written, oral, or graphic statement or representation made by a supplier in connection with the solicitation of business. It includes, but is not limited to, communication by noncable television systems, radio, printed brochures, newspapers, leaflets, flyers, circulars, billboards, banners, or signs. It does not include any oral, in person, representation made by a sales representative to a prospective purchaser.”

2) The ESRB rating system is not an advertisement by suppliers that retailers will not sell to minors. The ESRB rating system is arguably a device used to assist purchasers in determining whether to purchase the product based on the suggested maturity level of the game. It is not used to solicit business. Furthermore, the law itself does not contend that the ESRB rating system is in and of itself an "advertisement"-- it says that sellers/persons advertising that they will sell in accordance with the ESRB rating system are subject to the regulation. So merely having the ESRB rating on the game imputes nothing to the retailer.

3) Advertisements don’t include oral, in person representations of sales representatives. So a sales person could still make a statement concerning the ESRB to potential purchasers without that statement being an advertisement.

4) The bill requires that the seller “advertises that the person will not H. [ sell ] provide .H a good or service labeled with an age restriction or recommendation to a H. [ person under ] buyer subject to .H the age restriction or recommendation”

5) interpreting employee representations as “advertisements” creates a very obvious ambiguity in the law, which could in all likelihood render it invalid.

Absent some representation on the part of the retailer to potential purchasers that they card buyers, I’m not sure how this law is effective. Even having a poster that lists the ESRB ratings for educational purposes short of saying “we won’t sell to minors,” (I’ve never seen any such sign saying they won’t, but I may be missing something) lacks the requisite “statement and representation” that they won’t sell requirement.

That doesn’t mean I won’t laugh if a court finds this a transparent back-door attempt to regulate the sale of protected speech based on content. some have mentioned that this law is “without teeth”, but the entire law just seems to lack any kind of substance period now and seems like useless, impractical verbage

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

@mona.adele:

Regarding No. 4, if you dig deeply enough, usually on their websites, you'll find published sales policies from the major retailers (Wal-Mart, Target, Best Buy, Toys'R'Us, etc.) which say something along the lines of "we don't inappropriately sell age-recommended or -restricted products."  

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

PROTIP: When replying to a post made by "so-and-so" adding in "@so-and-so" is kinda un-necessary.

I know, I know, but the stuff keeps nagging and it drives me nuts. And before you say "tune it out" let me state for the record that I tried. It didn't work.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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"A Chrono Trigger is anything that unleashes its will or desire to change history!" -Gaspar

Re: Utah Bill Sponsor Talks About e-mail From Gamers

PROTIPOFMYDICK:

And, pray tell, Shadow, genius that you are, how do you tell the difference between a reply to mona.adele (to whom I intended to reply) and a reply to Erik (to whom I had no intention of replying). Perhaps you should just stick to posting facepalms and other drivel and quit giving unsolicited advice.

 
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