Female Gamer Sees Sexism At Play in MMOs

Are the virtual worlds portrayed in massively-multiplayer online games inherently sexist?

Although she believes the situation is improving, Jaime, a veteran female gamer, still sees a great deal of sexism in MMOs. In a column for MMOsite she explains her view:

From my own experience, in the early days of MMOs – looking back at Ultima Online and EverQuest – there was a definite attitude that women simply didn’t play games… Female players who identified their gender… [were] ignored. Women… [had] their skills and abilities in the game questioned…

Players began to slowly accept that there were women playing MMOs… Nonetheless, the attitude itself was still low and chauvinistic. I can recount at least half a dozen times while playing Dark Age of Camelot… [receiving] requests for pictures, breast size, age, if I was available for dating, and various sexual requests and connotations…

There’s also been one constant: the harassing of female characters… whispers soliciting cybersex, of course, but also more innocent gestures such as the use of emotes to flirt at, kiss, poke, tickle, tease, grope, slap, and otherwise virtually sexually harass a female character.

Not surprisingly, Jaime sees the anonymous nature of the online world as a major contributing factor in MMO sexism.

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  1. Sajomir says:

    Hmm I’m probably a little late for posting a response on this one, but…

    I absolutely agree that people do treat males and females differently in MMOs. It’s simply because we often treat each other differently in real life. (I don’t mean "differently" in real life as in sexist girls-are-worse-than-boys or something. I mean differently as in it’s considered more rude to glance at a woman’s chest than at a man’s. That if you’re a woman you will probably have more guys hit on you in public than other women.)

    When it comes to the in-game, I’ve experienced both acceptable and sexist situations while playing a female avatar. Some people simply wondered if I was actually a girl, while one offered to "dress [me] up like a doll" (referring to giving me equipment) if I joined his clan. That same guy tried to flirt with me several times. Since I’m a guy, I found it hilarious, but I can see it being a problem for some women.

    Then again, we have /ignore and blacklist options for a reason.

  2. Ryno says:

    Well I like the sexism, but I’m a guy. It’s not because I do it, simply that I always get a good laugh when someone hits on someone else or gives them gifts simply because of how their avatar looks. If you look at the numbers for % of females in games vs. the number of female avatars it doesn’t take a course in statistics to know that there’s a good chance it’s a guy behind the keyboard.

    Of course it also often leads to the whine/rage threads about how unfair and sick it is to play a character of the opposite sex. This does highlight the subtextual problem of such sexism, since these people believe that women are asking to be hit on and stalked simply because they’re playing a game. That’s something that needs to be worked on.


    Saying that Jack Thompson is impotent is an insult to impotent men everywhere. They’ve got a whole assortment of drugs that can cure their condition; Jack, however…

  3. Shahab says:

    This whole "its ok if the guy is gay" bullshit is not ok. I’ve known woman who who use that essentially as an excuse, as much for themselves as any boyfriend, to be intimate with another man but not consider it cheating.

    If another man or woman grabbed my gf’s breast I would not be ok with it, straight or gay, that is definitely pushing boundries.

  4. sparkylarone says:

    alright ima a guy and i tend to play female avatars  i havent once been hit onn or anything for that matter lol. people should be less uptite if somone does something that bothers you ignore it   . 

  5. RavenMitah says:

    If a girl honestly goes around advertising herself for attention and free items, then, yeah, she’s asking for it, just like anyone going around begging for items/currency.  But I shouldn’t have to hide that I’m a girl on the internet, just because of a bunch of horny teenage morons, either.  Guys don’t have to hide that they’re guys, so why should I have to hide I’m a girl?



  6. MichaelPaladin says:

    Personally I’ve seen guys in online games treat female avatars badly especially if they found out it really belonged to a real woman. And I have always found that in poor taste, and I’ve had many heated arguments with some of those a**hats.

    Maybe I’m little to "old school", because I tend to treat people that I meet in MMO’s just the way I want to be treated. And with that I will treat people in games just like I would if I was talking to them in the real world.

    And as for me I’m a 45yr old male, that works as a HVAC Service Tech, and enjoys playing Star Wars Galaxies and Eve Online. And also I build my own computers as a hobby.

  7. Seiena_Cyrus says:

    Honestly I’m a girl, I deal with it. I hate the giggly girl crap and I hate the annoying Jock mentality I run into on occassion but in general I ignore the flirts and the cyber requests and all that because it’s not worth my irritation. Heck I had a guy /tell me with "hey! You got a boyfriend?" and I responded with "I’m married…to that troll five steps from you." and the guy responded with "So? You got a boyfriend?" and while laughing I hit ignore and started off with my troll companion to kill mobs…the guy chased me around for an -hour- emoting the crap outta me and I ignored him till he went away…course I also called GMs on him but that’s because he really was purposefully harrassing me…that is the only time I see a point to calling Harrassment because usually once you /ignore they’re no longer capable of harrassing you.

  8. KayleL says:

    Sexism is a strange issue with online games. When ever a guy starts asking for pictures as proof, they usually find out though the girl saying she is one through the chat. If you don’t want sexual harassment, maybe you shouldn’t go around advertising that you are a girl. Don’t deny it, I know there are girls that go around advertising themselves (usually to get free stuff) and I see it happen all the time. If they find out through mic, then they know you are a girl, and if they ask for picture, it’s because they are horny teens.

    What I have notice in the past 4 years is that girls are getting much more common in online games. I remember in Counter-Strike, when ever a girl comes onine, the game practically stops. These days, I get a girl teammate every so often, and I don’t even hear "Wow, a girl!" from my teammates anymore. They treat her like any other gamer now.

    I haven’t played MMOs in a while now, so I don’t know how bad the sexism is now. But really, most sexism is from teens, and nothing you do to society would change horny teens. Only thing you could do is find a good guild.

  9. Wormdundee says:

    This is an article about sexism in MMOs? I mean this isn’t exclusive to MMOs, it happens all the time in any other game where it’s possible to quickly type messages or that has voice chat.

    But really, her recounting of a ‘half a dozen times’ is pretty weak evidence. Her entire time playing DaoC and it only happend roughly 6 times? That really doesn’t seem that bad to me. It also lines up with my experience playing MMOs. I usually have both a male character and a female character, and the female one has never gotten harassed in any way related to gender.

    But, I think I’ll conduct an experiment when Aion comes out. I’ll do my best to pretend to be a girl and I’ll see what happens.

  10. RavenMitah says:

    I know girls who would get upset at their own boyfriends/husbands getting them a dildo.  While some might say it was sexist, I honestly think they’re just prudes.  Horrible, terrible, repressed prudes.  Or sexist themselves.  Maybe both.

    Though what you said made me think of something.  The reason why straight men have to be careful about how they horse around with their girl friends, is because in a girl’s mind, certain parts of us are always on your mind/you’re attracted to them (and with the way guys are portrayed in the media, and with the way you guys act sometimes, this isn’t helped any).  That’s what makes it akward if my best friend who is straight grabbed my boob, but it wouldn’t bug me if my best friend who was gay did it.  The gay guy just sees them as a funny, bouncing object, but the straight guy sees them as something sexual.  Same thing would happen if my straight girlfriend did it; I feel nothing.  But if my lesbian best friend did it, it’d be weird.



  11. hellfire7885 says:

    Anonymity and not having the threat of physical pain is indeed part of it, as when the possibility of punishment is removed, a person’s true character comes through. It’s the same as say, in a restaurant, if a person is nice to you, and nasty to the waiter, then they are not a nice person.

    I personally try to be polite to everyone unless they piss me off greatly, which I admit can be hard to do unless they either push the right buttons or keep at it, which is what /ignore is for.

    The point is, if a person is nice to you in person but a complete dick behind your back, that’s who they truly are. If a person is nice to you in person and still is regardless, well, hey, people like that are few adn far between these days, or ever.

    Point is, most people in general are assholes but don’t show it when there are clear consequences for it. Remove those, and all bets are off. Doesn’t help that in text it’s hard to tell someone is joking or not, and in voice if one has a hard time reading voice tones.

  12. Speeder says:

    Yes, the way HOW they are being hit, are sult of the anonymousity of internet, and that is a actual problem, altough it only shows how people really are (people create "characters" for themselves taht they use in public when they don’t have privacy).

    But the amount of hitting, like I said, steems from the large amount of males… It is like when we see girls annoyed with "sexism" when they go near a construction site, a army camp or somewhere else with a large concentration of males, the result is that we will have some males hit the girl, with so much males, it will be a large amount, and men LOVE competition (some other mammal males too… several mammals use some sort of competition, even actual fight, to see who can hit the female, and we do that too, or where do you think that jousting, PvP and bar brawls come from? It is not masochism…), so sometimes when there are like 10% of the guys hitting on the girl, the others hit too only to not look gay or some other reason related to that (ie: show their "manliness"), but if there was in the game like 50% males and 50% females, I guess that the amount of hitting would greatly decrease…


    Also there are the problems that steem from our society that create the anti-social people, these are deep issues to be discussed here, but they exist, more and more people are getting anti-social for a variety of reasons, also there are "health problems" like excessive shyness, or autism, or actual uglyness or blindness or deafness, where people have anti-social behavior even against their own will, and on the internet someitmes they feel better, more easy to understand, and more courageous, some people only hit on the opposite sex online, some people has only online friends. So it is impossible to not ever expect being hit, because there are people online that see their only chance there. Sometimes they hit any girl that they see, because there are so much in need, that any girl is good.



  13. thefremen says:

    You aren’t the only one asking though, every other male player on your server does the same thing, this creates a hostile environment. 

  14. RavenMitah says:

    LMAO.  I totally agree about Gears of War. XD

    I agree about the buff/macho man stereotype.  Geeky, twiggy, or any other guy type doesn’t get enough love.  So, here’s more on my statement.  These macho men who beat things up, kill things, are ladies men, ect. help perpetuate these problems even further.  Guys are surrounded by this idea then, that they need to be macho, macho, macho, and that it doesn’t matter how you treat girls, they’ll come at you for some lovin’ anyway.  That’s not to say all guys in games are like that, just as not all the girls are curvy and big-boobed.  But more often than not, that’s what we get.

    Society pulls the macho card on you guys too, IRL, all the time. Guys end up insecure and/or act like dick heads in order to conform.  Girls always see the "cool bad-boy" types and how all other girls want them, and they end up with assholes and terrible relationships because that’s what they’re surrounded by.  It goes both ways.  I’m not going to argue that.  Guys should stand up for how they should be treated by other guys, and women, but I think most of you feel like you’ll be stifled and beat up by both sides if you do, and it’s sad.

    Me?  I’ll always stick with my pacifist, nice-guy who’s not afraid to be a wussie. 😛

  15. chadachada321 says:

    *phew* I thought you were being serious at first, lol.

    But yeah, I act gay around my friends all the time (especially the ones that are uncomfortable with their sexuality) to be funny, and bought my friend a dildo once when he turned 18, but if I did that to a girl, I can just picture the shit that I’d get for being "sexist" or "chauvinistic," even if I was just trying to be funny or playful.

    -If an apple a day keeps the doctor away….what happens when a doctor eats an apple?-

  16. RavenMitah says:

    Well, for teaching yourself written English, you’re actually pretty good.  So I’m sorry if I sounded rude. 😀

    It’s understandable that women will get hit on every now and again.  It’s expected in life.  The issue at hand is how often it happens, and sometimes, how rudely and immaturely it’s done.  When a girl goes out to a bar or club for a night out, she’s expecting to be hit on.  Not so much when she logs in to World of Warcraft. XD

  17. chadachada321 says:

    Ehh…I don’t really think that your last sentence is true. If I ask, and a girl says no, and I CONTINUE to ask, then it’s harassment. If I ask and she says no and I leave it at that, then it’s not harassment, it’s me being kinda creepy.

    -If an apple a day keeps the doctor away….what happens when a doctor eats an apple?-

  18. chadachada321 says:

    Have you EVER played Gears of War? That has basically everything BUT the cock-drills! All of the guys in that game have physically impossible muscles (without massive amounts of steroids). That is just as sexist as girls that are super curvy or have very large breasts. I feel that the visualization of men as super-muscular is about as common as women that have Lora Croft-sized breasts. I don’t think that it’s really that big of an issue, since the discrimination is fairly equal…

    (And, speaking of crotch-drills, some of the skins of Voldo from Soul Caliber II have spikes out of his crotch-region, if I remember right…)

    -If an apple a day keeps the doctor away….what happens when a doctor eats an apple?-

  19. GoodRobotUs says:

    Must admit, with a stealth character in Oblivion, there’s some strange urge to shoot the poor unsuspecting fool in the ‘nads with a Bow… It’s just something that’s genetically inground into men, I think.

  20. Speeder says:

    Males don’t call each other gay, don’t do "gay" things on purpose to annoy friends, neither buy plastic penis and give as fake birthday gift, neither do some more physical play, like kicking other guy nuts…



  21. Speeder says:

    First, sorry, specially for the non-existant words, I learned english on my own (I can not even talk in english, I don’t know how the words sound…).


    I am not saying that the girl there is totally wrong or something like that, but people must understand, that several men WILL hit girls, on some games the majority of the players are male, with only some females, it is obvious that these females will be constantly hit, and not for sexism, but plainly because there are much more male than female to hit on them…

    Let’s suppose that a agme has 90 females and 10 males… As soon as these 10 males hit everyone else, most of them (like… 8) will stop hitting the females, so each female would take 10 hitters and that is it (that is, if ALL men hit ALL girls).

    Now you have 11 million players, 2 million are girls, then each girl has potential to be hit 9 million times… You get it? It is not that people are really sexist and want to bother girls, it is just that there are so much males that even if a fraction of them hit on the girls, there will be still a huge amount of hitting on the girls.

    A person is not wrong to complain that people keep hitting, or inviting for cybering, I know how is this because altough a girl never even hinted want something with me, for some reason I attract lots of gays online… When I am playing online, any game, I get at least one gay cyber invite, and usually these guys are really persistant, and some even try to convince me to turn gay when I explain that I don’t want anything because I am not gay. But yet, saying that it is sexism, is missing the point, it may be results of the "anon", as people can bother others without fear of some stuff, but it is not sexism, it is normal human behavior… (or mostly normal…)



  22. woolf2k says:


    and even so…its participants are of either gender.

    but ultimately who is at fault for sexism in any world virtual or real? WOMEN. after all it’s mothers who raise us. Stop raising sexist children and it’ll disappear.

  23. thefremen says:

    I love how every time GP posts a story with a woman/minority group complaining about treatment in mmos/multiplayer games the comments are so predictable. First of all, there’s going to be at least 2 dozen of ’em, second of all they’re all going to be in staunch support of gamers and attacking whoever dares to criticize the misogynist, racist and homophobic attitudes so commonly found in multiplayer/mmo games.


    Also, requesting pics/breast size/cybering is harassment.  

  24. RavenMitah says:

    That… was incredibly painful to read.  Seriously.  Get a dictionary.  Most of your words don’t exsist. 

    And you’re completely overreacting/missing the point.

    If someone honestly gives you shit for glancing at a hot girl walking down the street, then they have issues, and are just being hypocrites.  Girls do the same thing to guys.  It’s a completely different story however, if you’re constantly staring at a girl’s chest and everyone knows.  Or you keep looking down when she’s talking to you.  People look at me funny if I constantly stare at a guy’s crotch.  It goes both ways, and it’s rude.  In both instances the members of the opposite sex are being turned into sexual objects, and no one deserves that.

    That being said, if you honestly can’t help yourself and have to flirt with every girl you meet, you better be ready to deal with the consequences.  Not every girl wants to be hit on.  They may not be in the mood, they may not be in to you, or they may just be plain uncomfortable with it.  Women aren’t sex objects, they’re people with feelings, and they might not feel the same way you do.  Yeah, if a girl blows up and sues you for "sexual harassment" over a pat on the back or one round of attempted playful banter, that girl has some serious issues she needs to work out, and she could probably use a good kick in the ass.  However, if you start flirting and the girl tries to stay neutral and gives you signs over and over again that she DOESN’T want to flirt, but you continue to persist, that is harassment.  I expect girls to treat guys with the same respect, so it’s not like I’m holding some double standard here.

    Now, here’s what this girl is arguing:

    Girls log on MMOs, just like guys.  We go on MMOs to play a game, and on average, unless we indicate otherwise, we are NOT there to date.  We are NOT there to be hit on.  We most certainly NOT there to have cyber sex.  We just want to play the game like everyone else.  If you decide to flirt, and the girl flirts back, by all means, keep flirting.  But you shouldn’t immediately be jumping to cybering and asking for pictures JUST because she’s a girl.

  25. Dragoon1376 says:

    I do believe you win.

    First secure an independent income, then practice virtue. -Greek Proverb

  26. Defenestrator says:

    "Women… [had] their skills and abilities in the game questioned…"

    Um, I’ve been playing MMOs for years, many times alongside female gamers who were perfectly competent at the game.  If your gaming skills are being questioned, chances are you just suck.

  27. Speeder says:

    I see all that so stupid…


    Yes, there are guys that are jerks, or are in extreme necessity to the point of keep requesting cybering and that stuff…

    But let’s get real: Men and Men, Women are Women, we ARE diffrent (mind you, I am not saying that women or men deserve a better/worse salary or voting rights and that stuff…), for Men, hitting on Women is not only natural but also instinctive, I never had a girlfriend, I don’t have time now to take care of one (I don’t mean that men need to take care of girlfriends in that sense, what I mean is that I don’t have time to don’t arrive late to see a movie, or time to see a movie at all… or to chat randomly…), but still, when I see a pretty women I look at her! Then people get all sorts: Oooh, you are a machist guy because you look at the girls! No!!! I am not machist, I am just a MEN, and men NEED women (or at least should… or the majority at least), and it is instinctive to look at women… People then get all supress your instincts and whatnot… And I ask: For what? Get sick? You see how much damage we are doing to ourselves sometimes being that way? Currently there are a discrimincation-phobia that is creating more discrimination than helping, I remember few years ago, when I was a child, I just went around playing with the neighbors of my grandma, I was a white guy, had some money (ie: I am not rich, I still don’t own a PS2 for lack of money to buy one), and there was other children that were black, japanese, girls, boys, poor, rich, all togheter playing, and noone cared, we don’t cared… Then people come with that gay rights, women rights, black rights, and whatever rights, and laws against racism, laws against sexism, and what I see is that people are starting to hate each other for that, for example I see that lot’s of companies now refuse black people… Why? No, it is not because they hate black people, it is because they feel that black people hates them, it is because that if a black person complain of racism, you get sued of your ass and has to pay millions to him, even if the racism was you dismissing him because he was not a good worker, I see now people that don’t hit women, they just rape them, because hitting on women don’t work anymore, they even sue you for sexual harassment, there are people that do the inverse, they become assexual, usually this has negative results on his/her life, but I see that, I see people that hate gays because gays keep pressuring on some rights that infringe that people right, I see for example lots of gay hating on religous communities that have the religious belief that being gay is a sin, while before that gay rights stuff the they do not bothered much gays, gays went around and people ignored them, some in the belief that after they got really converted they would become heterosexual again. But now instead, not marring (in religion, not legal… legally it is still a crime to a gay marry… ironic…) a gay is a crime, and I see open hating inside churches toward gays, not only as deterrant to them want to marry there, but also because they perceive the gays as trying to destroy their religion using legal artifices…

    It is all wrong, that racismphobia and sexismphobia is generating more racism and sexism and hate than anything else, I see laws for "racial equality" that enforce universities accept x% people of certain races, and while before a black guy on a university was just a black guy on university (even if rare and minority), now it is a cheater guy on the university because he got because of the system, not his own merits, at least the other students perceive him as such, and now we have racial hate (not only toward blacks) because laws that made attempt to give rights to minorities…


    Seriously… Hitting on a girl is sexism? So what I am supposed to do when I decide to have a girlfriend and marry, wait the girl hit on me? 



  28. RavenMitah says:

    It is great that games do that, keeping out the social stereotypes I mean.   Well, for the most part… Guild Wars still won’t let my female characters be as tall as the tallest male, nor can my male warrior be a short as some of the shortest females… but that’s not the point. >_>;

    There are still some things that games do continue to do that promote this issue.  Hypersexualization of women, for example.  Skimpy armors and large boobs that completely ignore all scientific laws, fast breathing/panting animations when the women are standing still, sex with multiple begging, subservient women, ect.  Games have gotten better about this, over time.  At least if they have an armor that’s way over the top sexually, they try and include something that’s equally conservative, but you still don’t see the same thing happening with males.  There aren’t crazy armors with drills or other large protruding objects at the crotch, or men fauning over one woman who’s in control.

    That’s not to say all of it needs to disappear.  In certain situations that sexualization is the point, and can be used for fun/humor.  We just need a better balance, which we’ve been progressing towards pretty nicely.  The thing is we need reminders every now and again, just to make sure we don’t lose that progress.

  29. nightwng2000 says:

    I think one major point that needs to be made is that it’s the PLAYERS, not the games, that is at fault.  These are attitudes of real individuals, not necessarily the characters in the game, unless someone has molded their character to be a certain way within a particular situation/setting.

    As games go, the overwhelming majority actually only treat gender as an appearance issue.  Stats are not positively or negatively affected.  Professions are not positively or negatively affected.  And, only in very specific cases, Races are not positively or negatively affected (usually, a Race’s capability to be of only one gender applies to the nature of the Race itself).

    Games do not, for example, reflect social stereotypes.  Games do not reflect the repeated argument that women are typically smaller, weaker, and less capable.  An argument usually used to imply that women cannot be abusers, especially domestic violence abusers or capable of committing other violent acts.

    Nor does the socially accepted "boys don’t hit girls" standard appear in games.  I mean, it’s "Player Vs. Player", not "Male Player Vs. Male Player or Female Player Vs Male Player (who, even if he only defends himself, is still a barbaric brute!) or Female Player".

    Games are, for the most part, designed to cross the barriers intelligently.  Something that real society has yet to do.


    NW2K Software


    Nightwng2000 is now admin to the group "Parents For Education, Not Legislation" on MySpace as http://groups.myspace.com/pfenl

  30. GoodRobotUs says:

    Well, not all my experiences online have been bad, I first met my wife online 😉

    But I do think that it’s way too easy, when someone says ‘sexism’ to assume that it’s only men being sexist to women, and I think that’s a mistake made in society in general, the concept of ‘anti-male’ sexism is alien to them, men are supposed to ‘tough it out’ or ‘be a man’ and take it on the chin, which is absolute rubbish, discrimination is discrimination, I don’t care who is doing it.

  31. Kajex says:

    See, my experience online has been different- I find most women to be overreactive, selfish spoiled brats who would just as soon bitch about alleged lack of team cohesion than roll "Greed" instead of "Need" for something they want, rather than require.

    See? I can do it, too. But to honest, that’s really been the case- 7/10 times, the experiences I’ve had online with girls playing alongside me is them whining about how I should continue to heal THEM, or that I won a "Need" Roll over something that would benefit me all because "my mage could really use it", even though they never bothered to mention it beforehand. No, it’s not always the case, and it could just be bad luck- and yet I’m not plastering it all as if it’s indicative of ALL female players.

    The only reason it’s okay for her to whine about something like this is because of "oh, I’m a female and it’s not okay". Sure, cybersex offerings are bad, but that’s what ignore is for. But emotes? Seriously? Is THAT what it’s going to degrade to? "BAAWW, some guy used ‘/em flirt’ on me, I feel violated/annoyed because of it!" Just shut the fuck up and continue your grind- if it pisses you off THAT much, just duel the fucker and leave afterwards.

  32. GoodRobotUs says:

    I suppose for me, the thing is, there’s a difference between a woman raising her eyes to the heavens and going ‘Men!’, which is more a term of endearment to my eyes than an insult, to an ongoing campaign to constructively dismiss someone because of their gender, and yes, I know that does happen to women too (and quite probably, more often).

    As I said, I actually agree with her position, there is a ‘macho attitude’ about many online communities that needs to be dealt with, though God alone knows how, but then, like with Media regulation, it should be all or nothing, there’s no such thing as ‘50% Fair’.

  33. Neeneko says:

    It is nice to see things are improving.

    Years ago I worked on a paper going over how women were treated in MMOs (back before WoW) and other on-line activities.  It was… not encouraging.  It highlighted all the gender issues sociaty still has and then added the ability to throw them around in anonoimity.

    It is actually a good way to study how far sociaty in general has come.  You strip away all the ‘let’s pretend to be modern and enlighted’ and quickly see much more of what people are actually feeling.

    To be blunt, we don’t shift from tens of thousdands of years of ‘women are property’ to ‘women are equals’ in a generation or two.    Sociaties simply do not change that quickly.  Just look at all the comments in this thread so far.

    It is, however, great to see progress.

  34. Neeneko says:

    Because it is not ok?

    This is one of the more insidious aspects of sexism.  Find a few examples that reenforce your own gender muck and then claim that it is unfair because ‘women are like that’.

  35. GoodRobotUs says:

    Whilst I don’t disagree with her opinion, from personal experience, I’d like to know why it’s ok for women to say things like ‘All men are liars’ or ‘All men are pigs’ without comeback, since, if it was going in the opposite direction, there’d be a shitstorm. But men are just expected to put up with it.

    I worked for three years for a female boss who hated men, and her co-ordinator, who was male, was too terrified of her to take any action. So, yes, equality is good, when it’s equality. There’s not just anti-female sexism out there.

  36. Adamas Draconis says:

    I have a female avatar in the MMO I play, my guild knows I’m a male and made the avatar just to satisfy my curiosity in the difference between how they show male/female armor.

    BTW male or female avatar, someone in the arena faceing you riding an elephant and swinging a glowing chainsaw is an intresting sight.

    Hunting the shadows of the troubled dreams.

  37. ZippyDSMlee says:

    I agree tho when I play as a female toon,ect I paly as a closet lesbain……as yatzhe would say I have grown a vag. >>

    Until lobbying is a hanging offense I choose anarchy! Stop supporting big media and furthering the criminalization of consumers!! http://zippydsmlee.wordpress.com/

  38. ZippyDSMlee says:

    Well if a whole segment of black culture did not use it for bro,girl,buddy,bud,ect it dose not really matter what the word was as a living language(English or Ebonics depending on who you ask) changes meanings and words as time goes on.

    Don’t get me wrong its still a loaded word that can not be easily used by anyone BUT its no longer an absolute negative meaning which more defines our lazy officials in office who are slaves to money than anyone else….


    Until lobbying is a hanging offense I choose anarchy! Stop supporting big media and furthering the criminalization of consumers!! http://zippydsmlee.wordpress.com/

  39. Afirejar says:

    Clearly there are cultural differences at work here, because in my opinion, calling ‘getting insulted once or twice a year’ a problem is an insult to people with problems around the world.

  40. Papa Midnight says:

    I personally think that the whole n****r as a term of endearmont thing is a crock of shit. Those that use it freely, I personally believe, do not understand its origin. Those that use it online and spout it do so because they can without reprocussion or believe (rather wrongly) that there are no blacks around or don’t care either way, and would typically never say such in the presence of another black individual – with the rare exception of course. That’s simply a fact. Now I personally don’t use the word and refuse to allow any of my friends to say such. I had another friend who was of Anglo origin and was under the impression that using an "a" as the suffix instead of "er" did not make it racist. Now I don’t know where this whole term of endearment or a mere modification of the suffix does not make it racist comes from, but I do believe it to be a crock.

    Papa Midnight

  41. ZippyDSMlee says:

    Don’t forget the N word has changed. A good bit of the black..err hip hop community uses it as a term of endearment and power its not inherently a racist term these days, loaded yes but like the trem bitch is losesing its negative meaning even if at a slower rate.

    PS:Canucks are sexy!!!!!!

    Until lobbying is a hanging offense I choose anarchy! Stop supporting big media and furthering the criminalization of consumers!! http://zippydsmlee.wordpress.com/

  42. Hannah says:

    No, that’s on a whole other level, so the comparison doesn’t quite work.  A word like "nigger" implies everything from disgust to outright hatred.  If a man flirts with me on an MMO, however, does that mean he hates me or even thinks less of me?  Of course not.  All it means is that he’s desperate.  I’ve seen equally desperate women flirt with men online too, although it’s obviously not as common, and I certainly wouldn’t call them sexist, let alone compare them to people using the n-word on blacks.

    Now, a better comparison is this: I’ve been teased for being a Canuck.  My accent sometimes gives me away, or I mention it myself, and it’ll be nothing but jokes about beavers, moose, and bagged milk for the next hour or so. It’s generally all in good fun, and it doesn’t bother me, but it still happens. Does this mean there is a pervasive anti-Canadian attitude in MMOs, or do Canadians just make easy targets for good-natured ribbing?

  43. Ratros says:

    I chatted with a guy for about a year, more knew him longer.  One day he came out and told us he was actually a woman.  Best shenanigan ever. 


    Although I do agree that I can kinda tell women from men and girls from boys and children from adults, there are those rare times.

    I once had a dream about God. In it, he was looking down upon the planet and the havoc we recked and he said unto us, "Damn Kids get off my lawn!"

  44. Arell says:

    Gender comes up in dialog occasionally, but most of what I was describing in my post comes simply from other players taking my female toon as face value.  Whether it’s the guy who won’t take a female toon into battle (lest her boobies be real), or the guys (plural) who try to become your new best friend or gaming buddy, that’s all from them believing that you are a woman because of the gender of the toon.

    There’s also the fact that I don’t hide my gender.  I may type up a gruff post now and then, and I don’t go around giggling "tee hee" in chat.  But after a while, if someone is paying attention, the types of words and general tone can be telling of your true gender.  Not to mention the rare, self-referencing pronoun.  It’s not so much about "acting" feminine, it’s just that men and women talk differently without even realizing it somethimes.  And other players can pick up on it if they’re alert.

    Often, I just "know" when a female toon is being controlled by a guy, even when they’re not being overtly "masculine."

  45. Ratros says:

    You could always play as a guy….or an orc…nobody wants to date an orc.

    I once had a dream about God. In it, he was looking down upon the planet and the havoc we recked and he said unto us, "Damn Kids get off my lawn!"

  46. Dragoon1376 says:


    I agree with you on the general idiotic/asshole nature of pugs but I’m curious about one thing: how does the whole gender thing come up?  I have a bunch of female characters and I can’t recall for the life of me the last time someone asked if I was a girl as well, which I’m not for clarification.  Maybe it’s a server thing if you play WoW or just bad luck with pugs. 

    Besides, no gender has the monopoly on suckage.  I’ve met plenty of girls that can play well and plenty of guys that need someone to hold their hands. 

    First secure an independent income, then practice virtue. -Greek Proverb

  47. Hannah says:

    From what I’ve seen, most "pervasive sexism" is simply a side effect of little boys being stupid.  They pick on everyone, and they will naturally use boobies as an excuse… just as they use accent, race, age, tone of voice, use/nonuse of internet slang, etc.

    As for the flirting, well… I’m pretty good at dealing with that.  I usually inform them in a matter of fact way that there are no girls on the internet, and anyone claiming to be a girl is clearly lying.  This works on voice too — at the very least, it will confuse them, and they’ll usually get the message.  It has the added benefit of making all real girls (and men in female avs) flip out in a hilarious way.

    Is it really sexist, though?  I don’t think so.  I think little boys are simply desperate… and it doesn’t help that there are many equally desperate women (and men pretending to be women) who will gladly take them up on that cybersex offer.  If the roles were reversed — if it was a game full of lonely preteen girls, for example — do you think men (especially those with with sexy sparkly vampire avs) would be able to walk an inch without similar propositions?

  48. yllamana says:

    There’s a lot of pervasive sexism in the MMO industry and MMO communities. It occurs at basically every level imaginable.

    That said, I completely agree on the comments thing. The most common, obvious one is the ROFL NO GRIL ON INTERNAT thing. Seriously, guys – I know you think it sounds funny, but the reality is we spend 100% of our online time being female on the Internet, it’s not exceptional or new to us, and no matter how funny it seems to you, it’s just tiresome and a bit alienating. 

  49. Arell says:

    You know, call it what you want, if "sexism" isn’t the right word.  But it’s fucking annoying being a woman in MMOs.  It’s one of those things where you don’t really "get it" until you’ve actually encountered it.  Unless you run almost exclusively with your guild, you’re going to get hit on by strangers (I won’t say "harassed," as that would imply the same ones doing it over and over, and once you’ve /ignored someone, it’s hard to tell if they’re still coming on to you).  One guy hitting on a woman once, from his perspective, is innocent.  But from the woman’s perspective, it’s the fifth /kiss, pelvic thrust, or lewd comment in a play session.  Even in a guild, you have those retards who think that since you said something nice to them, that’s an invitation to request cybering in /pm. 

    I think the most offensive behavior, though, is when you’re asked to "prove it."  Fuck off, I’m here to kill mobs, not to give lonely nerds a boner.

    As for people not trusting your skills, I’m not so sure about that one.  Ok, yeah, you’ve got that one guy every now and then that /kicks you from a PuG when your toon runs up, but to be honest, people irrationally and rudely /kick from group for all sorts of things.  Run an instance halfway through, and suddenly punted because his friend logged on.  Still a douchebag thing to do, but not sexist.  Actually, in the earlier days of MMOs, people would be extra nice to me about loot rolls once they saw that I could hold my own.  Of course, this is usually followed up by requests to be added to a /friend’s list, and then you get start getting /pms everytime you log on to play together.  It’s a more subtle form of flirting, but it’s better because you can actually start a friendship as long as you’re careful to never let them think they’re going to get anywhere with you.  Keep your comments neutral, and pretend you didn’t read any overtly flirtatious /tells, and they’ll eventually get the message that you aren’t looking for a date.

  50. Wormdundee says:

    This just in, if you play with a female avatar you are a closeted homosexual.

    Will you ever stop your madness Kefka? Your bigoted and prejudiced viewpoints shine through in every single one of your posts.

    I don’t even know what you’re talking about with female rights in game. All avatars are treated exactly the same by the system, the gender is not relevant. And what rights would there even be? Workplace equality? Voting? I really need you to explain this one.

    If someone is harassed they already have the ‘right’ to call on a GM to help them out.

  51. ZippyDSMlee says:

    oh wow doc………. well lets tackle these crazy comments one at a time.
    " What I fear is one day a very Liberal feminist will play this game someone will attack her and then sue the player and company for discrimination and force games to change the way how we play or in act restrictions because of this whiney minority."
    This is a possibility these days however more likely bans/kicks will be levied.

    Males prefer to play video games. Though some games have simplified game play and made some video games more attractive too female player but in turn eventually women will wants more rights in game and want more say. As in rules. As you know some cities a simple pat on the back can be considered sexual harassment. 


    Even if they garner special rights it will boil down to kicks and bans, and sexual harassment has kinda gotten out of hand due to the wish of protecting the individual feelings of the individual not not look at it from a more generic and standardize point of view and build rules around reasonable thigns and not upon the whims of the individual…


    "What scares me is video games will force homosexual content into games or the community to where if anyone speaks there mind then they are going to get punished. I simply can’t see Microsoft enacting Gay Rules or protections and then alienating a good amount of their base. I know Microsoft is a Liberal Company and GLAAD is pressuring them but I they are just a few people screaming at the top of their lunges. "

    Homosexuality is part of humanity and more normal than it is abnormal, I am surprised you are not picking on the devil worshiping in most fiction..yet homosexuality is such a no no….cherry pick much?


    "Again I point into the citizen imitative to ban gay marriage in the biggest leftist state in the Union California and voters saying no to it.  "

    Hate to tell you but marriage is not a religious matter a church and priest is optional but what is not optional in most states is the paper work of the local government.


    "However I will add that yes when there a girl in an MMO you’re going to get a lot of people flirting but now a days most people think females in game are actually males or as people consider them closeted homosexuals who like dressing up as a girl."

    Do you comprehend role playing? do you comprehend gender and sexual roles is how we defined it and not inherit to being human?


    Until lobbying is a hanging offense I choose anarchy! Stop supporting big media and furthering the criminalization of consumers!! http://zippydsmlee.wordpress.com/

  52. Arcanagos says:

    Wait, what? We started on sexism and ended up on gay marriage? Wh… I mean, WHAT?!?! My god, I know it’s Kefka talking, but that’s a leap even for his insanity.

    "Go ahead and hate your neighbor, go ahead and cheat a friend. Do it in the name of Heaven, Jack Thompson’ll justify it in the end." – nightwng2000

  53. Arell says:

    Gee, I think someone tried to hit up a female toon and got the surprise of a lifetime.  So scarred by the encounter, you must now break into mildly homophobic rants in response to articles that had nothing to do with gay players.  Good luck with that, and with improving your grammar.  I could almost understand most of what your wrote.

  54. Neo_DrKefka says:

     What I fear is one day a very Liberal feminist will play this game someone will attack her and then sue the player and company for discrimination and force games to change the way how we play or in act restrictions because of this whiney minority.

    Males prefer to play video games. Though some games have simplified game play and made some video games more attractive too female player but in turn eventually women will wants more rights in game and want more say. As in rules. As you know some cities a simple pat on the back can be considered sexual harassment. 
    What scares me is video games will force homosexual content into games or the community to where if anyone speaks there mind then they are going to get punished. I simply can’t see Microsoft enacting Gay Rules or protections and then alienating a good amount of their base. I know Microsoft is a Liberal Company and GLAAD is pressuring them but I they are just a few people screaming at the top of their lunges. 
    Again I point into the citizen imitative to ban gay marriage in the biggest leftist state in the Union California and voters saying no to it. 
    However I will add that yes when there a girl in an MMO you’re going to get a lot of people flirting but now a days most people think females in game are actually males or as people consider them closeted homosexuals who like dressing up as a girl.
  55. RavenMitah says:

    I’m sorry if it came off like I was accusing you of something.  I was just pointing out the times that it gets to be too much for my girlfriends and me.

    I’m seeing what your issue is though.  As a girl who’s grown up on video games, I spent a lot of time with guys, being one of the guys, because there just weren’t any other girls around who played games.  It’s not that girls want to be treated special, it’s just that, on average, we have a different sense of humor. 

    Here’s my own anecdotes: 

    I had a friend in middle school who liked to show me playboy, because he thought it was funny.  I was a 9 year-old girl at the time, I had no interest in playboy.  Why would I want to look at scantily clad women when I didn’t have an interest in them? 

    More recently, one of my girlfriends and I were standing in a circle with a bunch of our guy friends, just chatting.  Somehow one guy turned the discussion into an in-depth conversation about what it’s like to screw a girl on her period.  (Uhhh…. Yeah.  That wasn’t odd at all… >__>;) We didn’t freak out or anything, but it was uncomfortable for the two of us, and we really had nothing to say at that point.

    Most girls, myself included, tend to find jokes like your "I bet you swallowed, too" or "That’s what she said" to be immature, and not very funny.  I’m sorry if you friends honestly took it too seriously, but, really, they aren’t that funny to begin with. 

    I can’t speak for all girls when I say this, just myself and the girls that I know, but that doesn’t mean that I don’t yell and curse when I’m playing multiplayer with the guys.  Lord knows I had all my Brawl taunts set up to shout different obsenities in multiplayer so I could curse at my friends even if I was playing with them online.

    The thing is, guys do this to.  I have a friend I play online with frequently.  I recently learned in a conversation with him on Facebook that he takes the word "rape" very seriously, and can’t stand it when people use it willy-nilly in games.  My boyfriend and I use it a lot when… well…. we get swarmed with enemies and we don’t even think twice.  After that I now have to watch that I don’t use that particular word around him, out of respect.  It happens.  People are different.  I wouldn’t say I treat him "special," I treat him just like everyone else, minus a few phrases.  I mean, there are certain phrases I wouldn’t say to my parents, or 10 year-old brother, but I’m not really treating them "special."  Just being respectful. 

    With work you can find a happy medium.  Talk to your girl friends and find out what exactly about it bugs them, then you can just joke with something else.

    I really don’t know what to say about your highschool sports teams.  That’s just all kinds of screwed up.  I’ve never come accross something like that before.

  56. chadachada321 says:

    I love you.

    I tried the same thing for classes as what happened for your school and b-ball. We have an "Athletic Training" class (basically a gym class) and a "Girl’s Athletic Training" class. The course descriptions were almost identical, except that the latter was implied to be slightly easier. I chose the latter even though I’m male because I wanted an easier class that wasn’t too stressful, and also chose it partly to prove a point. Of course I got put in the former. I bitched about it to my (female) counselor and had a very humorous conversation…good times…

    I like to call what happens with *SOME* (note the some, not all) women and minorities "selective equality." They want the good parts about being equal but still wish to be "unique" so that they can gain the benefits of being treated differently also.

    Example: Affirmative Action. I don’t want to go much further because I don’t want to start a flame war, but I’ll leave it at this: You clearly don’t want to be equal at all if you want a higher chance of getting a job simply because you are a member of a race that was abused long before you were born.

    -If an apple a day keeps the doctor away….what happens when a doctor eats an apple?-

  57. Unruly says:

    I never said it meant automatically flirting with you or anything. I simply said that from my experiences, and yes I know its anecdotal, I’ve never been able to find a happy medium in how women like to be treated because if I treat them like one of the guys I’m an immature pig, but if I don’t treat them like one of the guys I’m not treating them like a person. No matter the fact that not treating them like one of the guys doesn’t involve demeaning them, it just involves not talking about the same things that get me called an immature pig – like dick jokes, that fight during the hockey game, and calling the other guys there closet homos every time they say something that could sound like they were if taken out of context.

    For instance, if I’m playing an fps with a bunch of my friends and one of them says "I just blew that dudes head off" I call them gay by saying something like "yea, and I’ll bet you swallowed too." If I say that to most of the girls I game with on a regular basis, in the same situation, I get yelled at for it because "its sexist" and it "isn’t a joke." Then when I stopped saying stuff like that when any of those girls were playing, they told me I wasn’t nearly as fun to game with anymore. They don’t want to be treated equally, they want to be treated special.

    And its the same in a lot of places, be it work, gaming, or sports. Its the reason why in school we couldn’t have a boys-only basketball league but the girls-only one was allowed to stay. And don’t you dare tap a woman on the shoulder to get her attention at work, because, god forbid, if your finger comes near a bra strap you’ll be getting your ass sued for sexual harrassment in about two seconds.

    Yes, I realize that second example is an exaggeration, and no, I’m not saying that every woman is like that, just that there are quite a few out there who are.

    And that example about basketball? That was completely true. Until high school we had a mixed league for basketball in the fall, and a girls-only league in the spring. Not to mention the fact that in high school if a girl wanted to play any sports that didn’t have a girls team she was automatically allowed on the boys team, but if a boy wanted to play a game that only had a girls team he was told to screw off. For instance(warning: more anecdotal evidence), there was a girl that wanted to play baseball in high school, so she was allowed on the boys team because there wasn’t a girls team. Well, a couple of the guys from the baseball team tried to join the softball team(girls only) to prove a point, and were told simply that they weren’t allowed to because it was a girls only team.

    I realize that at this point I’ve started to rant and went off on a bit of a tangent, but oh well. I guess my point is that a lot of women need to realize that if you want to be equal to one of the guys, expect to get treated exactly like one of the guys. There is no room for special treatment in equality.

  58. GoodRobotUs says:

    I think peer pressure plays a role as well, there are many teenage boys, in particular, who feel it’s almost a duty to be racist, sexist idiots, it’s partly anonimity, and partly ‘being one of the lads’, there’s almost a level of respect for being a complete dong, and that’s sad to see.

    Mostly though, I think it’s just the usual fear of the different, blacks, gays, females, they are all like different species to some of these people, because the only place they feel confident communicating is online, if you were face to face with these people, they’d either run away screaming, or be to socially inept to communicate in a grown up fashion.

    Like the kid at school who makes similar comments and then, when faced by the subject of their comments, either deny them, or turn to their mates for help, it’s easy to live up to your own definition of ‘brave’ when you think no-one is going to find out who you are.


  59. Hannah says:

    Whenever guys ask for my picture online, I have to fight the urge to send them goatse or some similar shock image.  Yes, I’m a horrible person.  I know.

  60. chadachada321 says:

    You refuted "girls can be annoying" by saying "boys can be annoying too!!!" Of course both sexes can be annoying to the other, it’s part of being human. Separating the "us" (guys) from the "them" (girls), and noticing differences between them. Is it right? Well, no, and as long as we don’t let it get too far it isn’t a problem either.

    Or your post could’ve just been a point about how guys can do the same annoying giggling as girls…lol

    -If an apple a day keeps the doctor away….what happens when a doctor eats an apple?-

  61. ZippyDSMlee says:

    Because bad mannerisms are not inherently sexism,racism,ect,ect. In the age of PCISIM we are trying very hard to label and slot all human mannerisms into preconceived petty and small definitions to protect everyone feelings  in a illogical and un reasonable manner.

    Until lobbying is a hanging offense I choose anarchy! Stop supporting big media and furthering the criminalization of consumers!! http://zippydsmlee.wordpress.com/

  62. Magic says:

    I don’t understand why you say it has to be institutional to exist – surely the act, of treating someone in a negative or unwelcome manner based on their sex, can be performed by anyone at any time and it will still be sexist, surely?

    It isn’t a surprising issue but I think she’s right to bring it up all the same, though I’m not sure what can really be done about it.

  63. unique78 says:

    Just use your wasd keys to turn your character instead of your right mouse button. They will think you’re a women.

    I only play women avatars with very girly names. In the 4 years of playing mmo’s, I think i’ve only been asked 2-3 times if I was really a girl.

    I always do

    /say wouldn’t you like to know!



    only once while playing wow, in scarlet monestary, did someone continue to pester me trying to find out if I was a women. Man that was funny.


  64. Neeneko says:

    Few males play female avatars in such a way that other males think the player is female.  It is surprisingly difficult to pull off since one usually has to fake an entire childhood of social ques.

    Behavior changes according to who one thinks is behind the screen.

  65. Balance says:

    I’m not so sure that argument holds water. I play a lot of female characters; the ratio is about 50:50, and almost all of them are pretty attractive (at least by MMO avatar standards). None of them have ever been hit on. On the other hand, a few of my male characters have been. I’m well aware that there are sexist incidents, but simply playing a female character does not guarantee that you will encounter them.

  66. ZippyDSMlee says:

    Depends on the context ‘nigger’ has become a word of endearment and power in the black/hip hop community and whites close to the black community use it as such. Even using it instead of negro(for the 80+ sect) is not inherently racist. People are quick to forget context and call anything anything because it feels good.

    Until lobbying is a hanging offense I choose anarchy! Stop supporting big media and furthering the criminalization of consumers!! http://zippydsmlee.wordpress.com/

  67. RavenMitah says:

    Yeah, we aren’t "one of the guys," because we are girls, but treating a woman as a woman doesn’t mean unnecessary flirtation, soliciting cyber-sex, and harassment because "LOL ther no gurlz on the internetz.  Pic plz."

    Honestly, I get tired sometimes of being called "he" automatically while playing Guild Wars with people I don’t know, so eventually I’ll point out I’m a girl, just like my character, and please call me "she."  That doesn’t mean I’ve given you permission to flirt with me and alienate me because I’m different and you don’t have the maturity to deal with it.

  68. Unruly says:

    This just in – girls get treated differently in yet another social situation. More at 11.

    Seriously though, there isn’t a way to not piss women off no matter how you treat them. If you treat them like "one of the guys," they get pissed because they’re not "one of the guys." If you treat them like they’re a woman, they get pissed because they want to don’t want to be seen as a woman. And I’m not meaning "treat them like a woman" as treat them as something less than a man, I’m just meaning you don’t make the same kind of jokes, etc around them like you would one of your buddies.

    Sure, online games aren’t the same and a player is a player, but you should expect that kind of stuff. Its the Greater Internet Dickwad Theory. Its the exact same reason why if you say you’re black/asian/Jewish/Catholic/gay that you’re gonna get a bunch of shit for it too. You think being a girl in an MMO is bad? Try being asian(especially Korean) and playing any RTS. I guarantee you’ll get a ton of jokes about Koreans and StarCraft thrown your way.

  69. d20sapphire says:

    Just because someone is an all around bully that will tease almost anyone doesn’t mean that they aren’t being sexist when they pick on a woman player because of her gender.  It still sexist to pick on someone’s gender as if it’s a detriment.


  70. Jarrod from Australia says:

    I have to admit, whenever I happen to be playing online and a player is identified as a girl from either voice of having a girly sounding name they do cop a whole lot of bullshit just for being a girl; ya know, constant flirting and being ganged up against. I don’t know if i’d call that sexism though; there are always bullies online; if they are not picking on you because of ur gender they’ll come up with some other bullshit, that’s not to day that type of behaviour is acceptable though.

  71. RavenMitah says:

    Males prefer to play video games. Though some games have simplified game play and made some video games more attractive too female player but in turn eventually women will wants more rights in game and want more say. As in rules. As you know some cities a simple pat on the back can be considered sexual harassment.

    Seriously… that whole paragraph makes him sound like a paranoid misogynist.  I was going to argue, but then I read the screen name… >_>;

  72. Magic says:

    My interpretation of his post is that women and homosexuals will be pushing for "rights" in games due to problems like how this female gamer has been treated. I believe we already have criteria in EULAs that allow companies to punish or ban people who don’t adhere to their code of conduct, but I’m sure that’s existed for years anyway so I don’t know what . Likewise, I don’t believe people would succeed in suing a company if someone else harassed them in a game – simply because it is not the fault of the company for it to happen, it’s just their role to attempt to prevent it (i.e. in the EULA).

    However: "homosexual content … I simply can’t see Microsoft enacting Gay Rules or protections and then alienating a good amount of their base… I know Microsoft is a Liberal Company …"
    "…people consider them [women] closeted homosexuals who like dressing up as a girl."
    This makes no logical sense to me, it reads like some sort of (and I dislike labelling people into groups) extreme conservative paranoia.

  73. Bennett Beeny says:

    If you haven’t encountered sexism in online gaming, you either haven’t been playing, or you don’t understand what sexism is.

    Try playing as a female character for a while.  Then you might get it.

  74. finaleve says:

    She should play WoW with me sometime 😉

    But seriously, I haven’t encountered any form of sexism, and I know a few females within my own guild.  Some are married, dating, and single.  We treat each other as friends, and have fun on the guild chat.

    While I understand being upset over the soliciting of cybering and all that, the usual gestures are going to happen.  Hell, my friend plays a female character and I occasionally whistle/flirt as a joke, even though I know the player is a guy.  If it was a female I would do the same, but be a bit more cautious, because I don’t want to offend.

  75. Bennett Beeny says:

    That’s funny, ‘cos whenever I meet male gamers, in groups of 2 and up, all they ever seem to want to do is giggle and check out the next best girl. It’s really annoying sometimes. It’s worse than the talking about football cliche.

  76. Tammej says:

    Then again, whenever I meet female gamers, in groups of 2 and up, all they ever seem to want to do is giggle and check out the next best guy. It’s really annoying sometimes. It’s worse than the shopping for shoes cliche. 

  77. yllamana says:

     "Sexisim is not "hey sexy" "whilstes" and other brain dead comments"

    Exactly. Sexism is institutional oppression based on your sex. It’s overly simplistic to boil it down to single incidents, because really, an absolutely immense number of factors contribute to it in small ways to create the end result.

    While a single occurrence might be insignificant, the bigger picture is a definite pattern with real effects. I’m really glad we’re on the same wavelength here, Zippy. 🙂

  78. ZippyDSMlee says:

    Sexisim is not "hey sexy" "whilstes" and other brain dead comments…….. my god what ever happened to real sexisim, sexaul harrasment and racisim…. now childish slights are the end the end of the world…



    Until lobbying is a hanging offense I choose anarchy! Stop supporting big media and furthering the criminalization of consumers!! http://zippydsmlee.wordpress.com/

  79. Bennett Beeny says:

    So by that argument, if a black guy gets called ‘nigger’ six times over the course of a couple of years, that’s not a problem.

  80. Afirejar says:

    This is totally a major problem, while I was playing Dark Age of Camelot it happened like six times!,

  81. fuji says:

    I’m a guy that will play female toons from time to time. I do get the whole "are you a girl" (use your own translation into any form of netspeak) to which I always respond with "does it matter?" and keep playing.

    What I always found helpful is if one is teamed/ganged/partied up with a jerkwad who won’t let it go, mention a few times in chat that if it doesn’t drop, then he’ll get dropped. This usually works better if you are the only healer in the group. Then don’t raise them. I did this all the time in FFXI, which lead to great fun and results.


    Right or wrong there’s going to be jerks on any medium that let’s them be annoymous. Sure, it’s off putting, but if you let the jerks win, then, yeah. The jerks should never win, and most of these games give you the tools to help you ignore them. *shrugs*

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