Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

August 26, 2009 -

Calls to boycott Xbox Live Arcade offering Shadow Complex because it is based on the works of anti-gay rights author Orson Scott Card may be falling on deaf ears, reports gamezine.co.uk.

Card is part of the National Organisation for Marriage: founded in 2007 to act as an organised opposion against same-sex marriage. Card has personally campaigned against gay marriage, which he believes would mark an end to democracy. He further argues that homosexuality is a dysfunction...

Whatever the case, it looks like the boycott didn't work. Following rave reviews, Shadow Complex has romped to the top of the most played Xbox LIVE Arcade titles, even entering the top ten of all Xbox 360 games played online.


Comments

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

Thanks for the links. I now have my new favorite quote:

"Me, I prefer democracy - even if it means letting dumb people like me have our say - and our votes. Studies have shown that when you let dumb people vote, it works out way better than letting experts make all the political decisions."

E. Zachary Knight
Oklahoma City Chapter of the ECA
http://www.theeca.com/chapters_oklahoma

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

Except that that the people in charge -- experts or otherwise -- do make most of the decisions, and not necessarily in the best interests of the voting public.

People vote for their favorite celebritician and the celebritician in turn makes the decisions. It's a bit like a game show.

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

Celebritician... I like that. Where'd you get it from, if you don't mind my asking?

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

Ah... I just came up with it for that post.

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

It's a good word. It should really catch on and be used more often since it accurately describes so many politicians.

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

Austin Lewis will never admit he's wrong, you do know that right? 

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

No kidding. Just see Austin's latest reply to grandparent post.

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

And why then the gays have the right to write that they want gay marriage?

Why gays can be outspoken and white male heteroxesual caucasians can't?

 

criadordejogos.wordpress.com

--- Maurício Gomes twitter.com/agfgames

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

Did I say he doesn't have the right to say whatever he wants?

I'm a straight white man so it would be pretty silly for me to say that straight white men can't say whatever they want.

 

http://www.popularculturegaming.com

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

I smell a u-turn.

So you're saying you won't support any work that Card was involved in, simply because of his opinions? Isn't that discrimination?

Also, I hope, since you feel so strongly about this, that you are at this moment diligently compiling a list of all the projects he's been involved with so as not to support him!

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

I don't really need to comple a list of his projects since most of them say "orson scott card" on them somewhere.

Regarding a u-turn, I don't see not giving someone I don't like my money as discrimination unless you want to use the term in its broadest definition of simply liking some things more than others. There's a difference between not liking a person's political views and not liking a whole group of people.

 

 

http://www.popularculturegaming.com

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

 A person's personal opinions can have absolutely no bearing on their works.  I love reading Kurt Vonnegut.  As a libertarian, I absolutely hate his out of book (unless you're reading shitty ones like Breakfast of Champions, Timequake, etc where they're in book) political and moral opinions.  I think they're shallow and lack real thought.  Yet this doesn't stop me from reading Slaughterhouse V for the 10th time.

Orson Scott Card is a good writer.  It only takes picking up and reading Ender's Game to figure that one out.  Until today, I didn't know of his philosophy on marriage.  Now that I know it, the book will be exactly the same.  Good writing is good writing.

And even if he is against gay marriage, why make him out to be a reincarnation of evil?  Last I checked, we're supposed to respect other people's opinions, even if you didn't follow them.  The "champions" of the gay marriage movement, the dems, the party of tolerance, are so intolerant of any idea that is contrary to their own that you're either with them on the subject, or you're satan.  No middle ground.  Ridiculous.  This is so long as they're not a democratic party leader, when in which case you seem to be immune to the hatred, as Obama, Hillary, Pelosi, and others in the party have said that they don't support gay marriage.  

But those are their ways, and if they wish to boycott a good game because they don't agree with the writer, then so be it.  I'll go ahead and enjoy it myself.

 

*I'll be unable to make further comments, so just to try and head off some attacks against my statement (and there'll likely be at least one seeing how I defended the rights of people who are against gay marriage), let me just say that I don't think marriage has any place in the government at all.  Thus, gay marriage is something which just further digs marriage into a political hole.  I'm against that much.  Should gay people get "married" instead of any of the half dozen practices which do exactly that without the word?  Sure, if they really want to.  Separate but equal showed it didn't work back in the 50s and 60s.  I can basically go either way on the subject, and really, I think the left blows the topic out of proportion.  Instead of deficits, power shortages, failings of the legislature and the executive, and other much more important topics to focus on, we're calling people who don't agree with gay marriage devils and try to get them strung up in any way possible.  

So it goes.

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

I almost got a tear in my eye from the beauty of your words. I, too, agree that marriage is something that should have nothing to do with the state, it is a private affair. However, I don't know what your feelings on the subject are, but as for "legal bonding," I think that any legal adult couple should be able to become legally bonded and share the same rights as any other legally bonded couple, regardless of race/gender/religion/lack-of-religion. (What legal rights to married couples even have today? Some tax stuff and insurance stuff, but what else?)

-If an apple a day keeps the doctor away....what happens when a doctor eats an apple?-

-Optimum est pati quod emendare non possis-It is best to endure what you cannot change-

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

They're probably lucky the boycott isn't starting. The game sounds like it's popluar; the last thing these people should want to do is give it a ton of free advertising by making a fuss.

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

The free advertising would be secondary to the loss of perceived importance of a cause from a failed boycott.  Gay rights may be important, but if this boycott were to get more widely publicized and then fail spectacular, the appearance would be that most people don't care about gay rights and that everyone could treat them as irrelevant.  In the end, that would do more harm than good to the cause in question.

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

What? I understand appearance is everything but those who don't care about who's gay or isn't and those who who do care for the wrong reasons arn't going to have their minds changed or their actions influenced for one minute. No one is going to hear about the boycotts failure and feel emboldened to act out against the first gay person they encounter. They'll just do it anyway.

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

I can't find any anti-gay rights books written by Card.  Are you sure he's an anti-gay rights author?  It looks like he is mainly a Sci-Fi author.  So your personal politics determines your art now? 

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

Pro-eugenics pro-genocide pro-segregation would be a description based on his books. That any better? 

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

"Pro-eugenics pro-genocide pro-segregation would be a description based on his books. That any better?"

No.  That's like labeling an author who writes about the holocaust as pro-holocaust pro-eugenics pro-genocide pro-segregation.  Feel any smarter cunt for brains?

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

Funny you should bring up the Holocaust: http://peachfront.diaryland.com/enderhitlte.html

 

I don't know how you could read Ender's game and not come to the conclusion that Ender is supposed to be a sympathetic character. 

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

You do remember how Ender was treated as a kid, right?  Everybody shit on him, and he was forced to help them.  That's the mindset of how he's supposed to be a sympathetic character.

---

He was dead when I got here.

--- With the first link, the chain is forged.

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

Agreed.

There is a critical difference between the phrase "anti-gay rights author" and "author who has anit-gay rights opinions".  Loading the summary in such a fashion seems a bit underhanded.

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

The people that are pressing for the boycott clearly don't care about the distinction. Also "anti-gay rights author" is still a perfectly valid description of Card. It's ambiguous, but grammatically correct.

-Gray17

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

So let us say Dennis McCauley was pro-gay rights in his personal view.  Let us say he publicly said so.  Would that then make him an "anti-traditional marriage" journalist?  If so would that then make him unable to be an objective journalist when it comes to the issue of gay rights/traditional marriage and the reporting of such stories? 

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

No that wouldn't make him an "Anti-traditional marriage" journalist as pro-gay rights != anti-traditional marriage. He'd have to speak out against traditional marriage to be an "anti=traditional marriage" journalist.

-Gray17

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

anti-gay rights people like to claim that if we let gay people marry then somehow straight people WONT be able to.

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

Really?  Cuz I've never heard that argument before.  I always thought the predominant argument against gay marriage is that there'd be precedent for allowing polygamy, interspecies relationships and relationships between of-age people and minors, as the argument allowing gays to marry is that they're "in love."  In the relationships I listed, the exact same argument could be made for any number of groups within them, so why should they be kept illegal if gay marriage is allowed?

That's the argument I've always heard.

---

He was dead when I got here.

--- With the first link, the chain is forged.

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

I guess so. If I start taking that stance, I'm not going to be able to read 3/4 of the novels for my Lit classes though...

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

Trying to boycott a game because the story is based off of the creative work of someone who has a different personal opinion than them? God I love this country.

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

Depends on the opinion. I'd boycott the products of someone who was openly racist, for example.

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

Eh the guy's a nutjob. But if the product is good and doesn't actually endorse what this one guy feels, then it shouldn't really matter. Like Invader Zim. Yes, the creator was nuts, but the product was good and buying the product doesn't formally or practically constitute supporting the person, but rather the product/company.

-If an apple a day keeps the doctor away....what happens when a doctor eats an apple?-

-Optimum est pati quod emendare non possis-It is best to endure what you cannot change-

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

Wait. What? Jhonen Vasquez deserves to be compared to a dude who thinks gay marriage should banned and anti-gay sex laws NEED to stay on the books and be enforced because...What? You don't like Happy Noodle Boy? 

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

...Uh...a large part of America (and many countries in the rest of the world) think that gay marriage should be illegal. I disagree, but I do respect his opinion. So I shouldn't buy any foreign (and almost every Amreican) product because it's likely tied to someone that thinks that gay marriage is wrong?

-If an apple a day keeps the doctor away....what happens when a doctor eats an apple?-

-Optimum est pati quod emendare non possis-It is best to endure what you cannot change-

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

SO WHAT THE HELL DOES ANY OF THIS HAVE TO DO WITH JHONEN VASQUEZ? You still haven't made your case for why Jhonen Vasquez=Orson Scott Card. 

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

I was just saying that Jhonen was kinda a nutjob but that wouldn't stop me from buying a product of his. I don't even entirely know if he's actually crazy, I was just going off of a rumor that I heard a long time ago, that was just the best example that I had at the time.

-If an apple a day keeps the doctor away....what happens when a doctor eats an apple?-

-Optimum est pati quod emendare non possis-It is best to endure what you cannot change-

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

Wow so you won't let the fact that he's Bi keep you from watching Invader Zim. Wow, how enlightened. Thing about Orson Scott Card is that his point of view is present in his books. In Speaker for the Dead Ender talks about how this dude who died wasn't such a bad guy for beating his wife because she didn't mind on account that she cheated on him. Ender was a product of Eugenics but Eugenics is OK because he worked out. Ender committed genocide but that's OK because it was to save humanity and he felt very bad about it afterwards. 

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

My! How the tables have turned.

If you`re pro-gay, say it loud. If you`re not, don`t ask, don`t tell.

"They don`t know what they`re doing. They`re simply unenlightened and vulnerable to manipulation." -Janos Audron

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

What the hell do you mean? Yeah of course I'm for equal rights across the board. 

Re: Shadow Complex Boycott a Non-Starter?

No you're not.  You think that equal rights are only for those that agree with you.  You've proven that countless times.

---

He was dead when I got here.

--- With the first link, the chain is forged.
 
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