Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

March 21, 2011 -

Want to cure those pesky homosexual tendencies? There is apparently an app for that. Apple is taking some heat for allowing an app on iOS that claims to cure homosexuality. The app was created by a ministry group called Exodus International and purports to "teach gay people that they have a choice when it comes to their sexuality," and that they have a choice to choose "freedom from homosexuality through the power of Jesus."

Gay rights group are confused by the inclusion of the app because Apple is considered a progressive company that generally supports the rights of gays and lesbians and even extends benefits to domestic partners.

On the other hand, does Apple have the right to censor an app based on its own policies and public position on issues? We will leave that question to readers. Apple's censorship of apps is seems to be unconventional; it will ban political comedy apps and then approve an app like this.

Source: Yahoo

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Comments

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

What qualifies something as a "religion" anyway? Would an atheists club that does just about everything a church does qualify as a religious institution?

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

well since they came out with that, someone has to come out with a "Cure for Heterosexuality" app to prove a point that its not a choice, despite what many religions may think.

 

 

to try to correctly quote 2 The Ranting Gryphon; "If its a choice then you, for five minutes, decide to be gay, and be attracted to the same sex."

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If you don't like something I said in a post, don't just hit the dislike, let me know your thoughts! I'm interested in knowing everyone's opinions, even when they don't mesh with my own.

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

Or even better, a "Cure Religion" app. If people weren't bound by religion, everyone would be a lot more tolerant of each other, right?

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

"If people weren't bound by religion, everyone would be a lot more tolerant of each other, right?"

Well, no. You'd still have to "cure" politial parties, race, nationalism, patriotism, ideologies, opinions in general, and pretty much anything that could possible make people different and/or hold opposition to one another.

 

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." -Albert Einstein

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." -Albert Einstein

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

Just about all of which can be linked back to religion as its basis. My main point is that almost everyone who has a problem with homosexuality hates it because their religion forbids it. I'm comfortable saying that if it wasn't for religious belief that homosexuality was an "abomination", Men would be legally married to each other and women would be married to each other in all 50 states.

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

Wait, last I checked, your point was: "If people weren't bound by religion, everyone would be a lot more tolerant of each other, right?" It wasn't "that almost everyone who has a problem with homosexuality hates it because their religion forbids it." If you want to make that as a new point, fine, but my response was to the original one. Actually, I've got more than one issue with this point as well, but I'll get to that. Anyway, none of these are linked directly to religion as a basis. Political parties are a separate ideology type. Race issues certainly never required religion. Nationalism and patriotism (not really the same thing) are certainly different to religion as well. And ideologies are the basis for religion, not the other way around. Opinions? Forgot about those. If anything, all of these, including religions, are types of stances. They may intermingle, but the all have the same social potential when all else is equal, and don't depend on other types to do what they do. There are those who have held intolerance without religion for as long as intolerance has exisited. Hell, where does one put the blame if a LGBT supporter was ever intolerant? Religious motivations? Or perhaps if one were to find an atheist?

Now, as to the comment that I said I'd get back to. First, it's presumptious, and probably incorrect, to state that most people who have a problem with homosexuality somehow "hate" it. Second, even if today their are religious issues with homosexuality, how do you know that some other form of ideology wouldn't have issues with homosexuals? Historically, it's happened before. Then there's social reasons, such as images of masculinity, that cause contempt. And let's look back at religion. How many actual religions are targeting homosexuals? Christianity alone isn't totally made up by the same views on homosexuality, even between groups that some may percievie views of these groups as the same sort of "hate". And let's look deeper. Assume that all the religions that had an issue with sexuality were first being created. Why an issue with homosexuality? Can't blame religion if the religion is just being made? In other words, even if one looks at it through the perspective of one who thinks religions are all made up, issues with homosexuality doesn't depend on religion.

 

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." -Albert Einstein

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." -Albert Einstein

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

"On the other hand, does Apple have the right to censor an app based on its own policies and public position on issues?"

If we are talking about the Bill of Rights, then yes.  The Constition applies to the United States government, not private businesses. 

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

"Gay rights group are confused by the inclusion of the app because Apple is considered a progressive company that generally supports the rights of gays and lesbians and even extends benefits to domestic partners."

And as we all know, progressives simply cannot allow the existence of an opinion that differs from their own.  AMIRITE?  That is mostly sarcastic, of course, but it does strike me as curious that a group which claims tolerance as one of its core values has so many people who cannot seem to apply it to other peoples' opinions.  I guess to them, tolerance is only important regarding a select few criteria such as skin color, sexual orientation, etc.

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

Erm, being intolerant of intolerance isn't really hypocritical.  The intolerant people in this situation are the people trying to "cure" gays, not the people telling them to take it elsewhere.

It's not a matter of wanting to silence everyone who disagrees with you, it's a matter of protesting people who disagree with you on the subject of whether or not it's okay to be gay.

And Apple's incoherent mess of an approval policy makes it all the trickier.  If the App Store were a free-for-all, then I'd absolutely agree that no app should be refused (short of doing harm to a user's system).  But it's not; Apple approves all apps that get published on it, and has refused some for much more ridiculous reasons than this one.

Apple's granted its approval to the app; people are petitioning Apple to remove it.  Consumer protests and boycotts are a vital mechanism in the free market, and protected just as strongly by the First Amendment as religious views.  What the First Amendment DOESN'T protect, however, is a right to get your program published on the App Store.

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

"That is mostly sarcastic, of course, but it does strike me as curious that a group which claims tolerance as one of its core values has so many people who cannot seem to apply it to other peoples' opinions.  I guess to them, tolerance is only important regarding a select few criteria such as skin color, sexual orientation, etc."

Congratulations, you've figured out one of humanity's greatest hypocricies (in general, not specifically gay rights groups.). People love tolerance for themselves and those they sympathise with, but too often will ignore intolerance against other human beings, especially intolerance aimed at those that disagree with their views, even on tolerance.

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." -Albert Einstein

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." -Albert Einstein

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

Well it's not a hypocrisy if you don't make pretentions to being "tolerant" in the first place. In other words, it's not possible to be universally tolerant, but it is possible to be universally bigotted, as in, "I'm an equal opportuinity racist. I hate everyone equally."

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

True, I probably should have mentioned that, though it assumes that one claimed to support tolerance. But I would disagree on a point. It is possible to be universally tolerant, assuming you hold the same tolerance "policies" and levels of tolerance to all types of people. Extremely difficult, yes. Impossible, no.

 

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." -Albert Einstein

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." -Albert Einstein

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

I really have to wonder what is more ridiculous.

The idea that you can "cure" homosexuality (or that it is something to be "cured" in the first place).

Or the idea that it can be cured with an APP! 

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

I bet that if a "cure" actually existed many gay people (religious and non-religious) would use it.

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

I highly doubt that as many of them might like who they are.

 

Sad part is some that would use it, well, I doubt they would by choice.

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

Well, that would depend on who peddled it.

 

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." -Albert Einstein

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." -Albert Einstein

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

> "it would also be nice if Apple followed its own guidelines, seeing how this is homophobia and is thus hate-speech"

No wait, that doesn't make sense on three counts. First of all, Apple shouldn't be able to disallow people from running whatever apps they want on the phones they own because you should own what you buy. The concept of "buying and selling" means that once Apple sells the phone to you, the phone then belongs to you and not to Apple anymore. This is the basis of all private enterprise and commerce. If we compromise that then we are facing the elimination of the rights of individual liberty and property. This is why I do not buy many Apple products because I will not help to compromise these principles.

Second, (unlike the idiots at Westboro Baptist who do not represent any mainstream religoius group and are so political that they may not even qualify as religious) Exodus International doesn't force itself on anyone. If someone has unwanted homosexual tendancies and they seek help to get rid of them, YOU are the one being intolerant for deriding them for doing that. Who are you to tell them how to live their life? How is it worse to censure someone for seeking to control impulses than to censure them for seeking to give in to them? What happens to all your rhetoric about tolerance and freedom when someone makes a lifestyle choice that YOU don't agree with? Here we have a clear illustration of what's been called "the intolerance of tolerance."

Third, an app that gets rid of homosexual impulses? That sounds ridiculous. I doubt it will do anyone any good, by which I mean, I don't think it will work. It would be doing a good thing if it did work because it would be helping people achieve a goal they desire which isn't hurting anyone, whether you desire it for them or not. But it sounds absurd for such an app to exist simply on pragmatic grounds.

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

Please use the reply button when responding to a specific post.

 

Andrew Eisen

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

He probably did.

When you aren't logged in, and you click Reply, it sends you to a login screen, then dumps you to a "new comment" text box instead of a "reply" one.  It's very easy to miss if you're not paying close attention.

It's a site design problem at least as much as a user behavior one.  And site design is much easier to fix than user behavior.

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

There's no reply button when you're not logged in but I see what you're saying.  I'll send a note to the devs and see if this is something that can be addressed.

 

Andrew Eisen

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

I say leave it up.  It's shit like this being out in the open that makes it all the easier to demonstrate the absurdities committed in the name of religion.  The faithful are always better at turning people off to religion than people like Richard Dawkins ever could.

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

That's not saying much, considering Richard Dawkins was never that good at turning people off of religion in the first place. And of course religious people are going to be the primary reason for getting someone against religion or for it. Religious people, by representation, are religion.

 

 

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." -Albert Einstein

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits." -Albert Einstein

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

I intend ot never own an I-anything, and this continues to help me stick to that.

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

Eh, the app sounds absolutely pathetic but I don't really care about it being included because I don't agree with censorship.

The problem is that Apple is rather inconsistent with what they censor and what they don't; I could understand if it were on a "how many people reported this" basis but frankly, that's privy to so much abuse.

Censorship isn't a one-way street. You can't just censor one thing and not censor another, you either censor everything that people seem to dislike or you don't censor anything at all. I, for one, would rather the latter, since you can't please anyone all of the time, anyway.

-- Randi Tastix

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

Unless, of course, you don't mind being an obvious hypocrite.

 

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

Eh, it's Apple's store, it can approve or disallow whatever it sees fit.  It would be nice if its guidelines were a bit clearer though.  It does seem to be a bit of a crapshoot sometimes as to what gets the green flag and what doesn't.

As for this paticular app?  It's stupid (it could be hilarious but I'm pretty sure the folks behind it are totally serious) but so is most of the crap in the app store.

 

Andrew Eisen

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

it would also be nice if Apple followed its own guidelines, seeing how this is homophobia and is thus hate-speech

either way, there's a petition here

 

岩「if Phyllis Schlafly wants to undo Women's Rights, she should lead by example and get back in the kitchen」

岩「…I can see why Hasselbeck's worried about fake guns killing fake people. afterall, she's a fake journalist on a fake news channel」

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

Have you seen the app?  Whether or not it's hate speech relies on specific details of the group's message.  Particulary, do they focus on homosexuals (the people) or homosexuality (the thoughts/actions of individuals).  Keep in mind that most Christians agree that no one, including Christians, are perfect. 

 

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

Except me, I'm perfect. 

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

This is not homophobic and it is not hate speech. This isn't preaching anything (to my knowledge), it is simply allowing people to change their sexuality if they so wish (although that isn't possible). It is up to people whether they wish to download this themselves, it is not forced upon anyone.

Aren't you preaching some sort of bigotry by saying that people should be forced to live their lives with a particular sexuality and that they shouldn't be allowed to change it? Theoretically why shouldn't there be freedom of choice for people to live their lives how they so wish?

The whole issue of a "cure" for homosexuality worries the gay community greatly and so they get overly concerned at some pointless app like the one in question.

Re: Apple Approves App that ‘Cures Homosexuality’

How is this homophobia or hate speech? It is a religious app from a religion that believe homosexuality is a sin and people can change when they rely on God.

If that is hate speech then all religions would be illegal.

E. Zachary Knight
Oklahoma City Chapter of the ECA
http://www.theeca.com/chapters_oklahoma

 
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ConsterSleaker: if you think there's only been "a handful of" incidents, you have your head stuck *somewhere* - I'm assuming it's sand.09/20/2014 - 5:38am
prh99Most of it's agitprop clickbait anyway.09/20/2014 - 5:27am
prh99A good reason to stop reading reguardless of view pointhttp://www.theguardian.com/media/2013/apr/12/news-is-bad-rolf-dobelli.09/20/2014 - 5:22am
Andrew EisenWell this is unique! A musical critique of the Factual Feminist's "Are Video Games Sexist?" video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-K4s7cV4Us409/20/2014 - 2:41am
Andrew EisenSome locked threads. Some let them be. So, no, I'm not seeing a problem here. No corruption. No collusion. No ethical problem with privately discussing ethics.09/20/2014 - 12:48am
Andrew EisenAnd still, in the end, Tito made up his own mind on how to handle his site. All 150 or so members went off to handle their own sites in their own ways. Some talked about it. Some didn't. Some changed disclosure policies. Some didn't.09/20/2014 - 12:40am
Andrew EisenThere were two comments other than Kochera and Tito's. One pointed out the Escapist Code of Conduct, another comment was in support of Tito.09/20/2014 - 12:40am
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Kronotechnical reasons. Anyways, I need to get to sleep as well.09/20/2014 - 12:29am
KronoAnd he wasn't the only one pushing Tito to censor the thread. If Tito had bowed to peer pressure, we likely wouldn't have gotten this http://goo.gl/vKiYtR which grew out of that thread. Said thread also lasted until a new one needed to be made for09/20/2014 - 12:28am
Krono@Andrew So it's an example of Kuchera crossing the line from reporter to advocate. And an example of the group pressuring for censorship.09/20/2014 - 12:21am
E. Zachary KnightAnyway, I am off to bed. I will probably wake up to all of this being knocked off the shout box.09/20/2014 - 12:20am
E. Zachary KnightKrono, that is the type of reading too much into things that bugs me. Ben did no such thing. Greg had the last word in that part of the exchange. The rest was about how to approach the story and Quinn.09/20/2014 - 12:19am
Andrew EisenSo?09/20/2014 - 12:13am
KronoExcept that the forum thread wasn't harassment, and Kuchera continued to push for the thread's removal after Tito made it clear he didn't consider it harassment.09/20/2014 - 12:12am
Andrew EisenPersonally, I see nothing wrong with someone offering their opinion or the other person making up their own mind on how to run their site.09/20/2014 - 12:06am
E. Zachary KnightKrono, I read nothing of the sort in that email chain. I read Ben giving advice on what to do when a forum thread is used to harass someone and spread falshoods about them and others.09/20/2014 - 12:05am
KronoThat's exactly what Ben Kuchera was doing to Greg Tito.09/19/2014 - 11:58pm
Krono@EZK So you see nothing wrong with one journalist pressuring a journalist from a different organization to not only not run a story, but to censor a civil discussion already taking place?09/19/2014 - 11:56pm
E. Zachary KnightI write for a number of blogs and talk to people who write similar blogs all the time for tips and advice. I see nothing wrong with that.09/19/2014 - 11:50pm
 

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