PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

June 22, 2011 -

German PlayStation 3 coder Alexander'Graf_Chokolo' Egorenkov said that because he doesn't have the money to fight Sony he expects to spend some time in jail. Egorenkov was targeted by Sony last year for hacking PS3 code to re-enable OtherOS on the console. Egorenkov was sued by Sony and forced to take all his material related to the hack offline. That site has been replaced by a donations page to help pay for his legal fees.

Speaking to supporters on his web site this week, Egorenkov said that his situation is looking bleak because he doesn't have the money to fight back:

"Hi guys, no money left anymore. Going to jail soon probably because I cannot pay court costs.

But I'm ready to stand up for everything I said and go to jail for that too. It's not important to win, more important is to show them that we are ready to fight, that they cannot scare me off easily. Yeah, I'm ready to go to jail for my [beliefs] and my principles.

Most of people probably think that all computer and kernel hackers are weak kids, hiding in a cellar, eating pizza whole day, writing software and looking for attention. Maybe, but that's NOT me. And I will get out eventually and continue my work. My work means very much to me."

Source: C&VG


Comments

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

I really don't think he did anything immoral. Adjusting a product you own to work as advertised? What is wrong with that?

This wouldn't even be debated if this was a modification to his car.

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

You all realize that there is a double standard going on here? The US military is still using the "otherOS" feature for distributed computing processes. Sony had this feature, marketed it, then changed their mind which is their right to do, however what they are doing to this Graf_Chokolo guy is a little unfair when Sony is allowing the military to continue their project while suing Graf.

Here is the Air Force project and there are many others. www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2011/03/rome_labs_supercomputer_is_mad.html

All of these research projects use the "OtherOS" option to do their thing.

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

That's not a double standard if they are using the old firmware. If they hacked the consoles to achieve this, then it might be considered hypocritical. Don't jump to conclusions.

-Greevar

"Paste superficially profound, but utterly meaningless quotation here."

-Greevar

"Paste superficially profound, but utterly meaningless quotation here."

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

I am sorry but it goes against human rights if we can not own software and have access to media outside of the retail chain. Sure the retail chain and IP owners should have absolute control over monetary flow but if its traded under no monetary flow then there can never be a crime as making free will and reading an unapproved book a crime is nothing short of book burning and turning history into lies due to rules of copy right.


I have a dream, break the chains of copy right oppression! http://zippydsmlee.wordpress.com/2010/05/21/cigital-disobedience/


Copyright infringement is nothing more than civil disobedience to a bad set of laws. Let's renegotiate them.

---

http://zippydsm.deviantart.com/

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

I'm pretty sure I read that as "Retail and IP owners should have absolute control over monetary flow", alongside "There shouldn't be a money flow". I'm pretty sure even you see a contradiction there.

If you haven't noticed, we live in a digital age. Livings are made, and fortunes are made and lost in zeroes and ones. If there is no money flow from IP and copyright, how do people get paid? Where does the money go? How do the holders of said IP and copyright put food on the table? What you seem to be advocating is a lifestyle that's almost a sure track to drive us even deeper into recession.

On top of that, if there's no money to be made in producing IP, there will be much less motivation to produce it. Why produce something if you can't feed yourself or your family with it?

Mind you, I'm all for free information, but when free information is putting an innocent developer out of house and home, that's where I draw the line.

_____________________________________________________________________________

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

"If there is no money flow from IP and copyright, how do people get paid? Where does the money go?"

That's the problem. You've never thought about it long enough to consider another model, so you just complain that if they can't do it this way, they can't do it at all. The last time I checked, people pay other people to do the things they can't or won't. It's called a service. Treat the content industries like the service they are and new models will open themselves up to anyone willing to experiment. The content industry is addicted to copyright and control. That's their problem; they can't let it go. They're afraid of risk, so they will abuse the law and the public to hang on to their addiction any way they can. Finding new models is risky and copyright is an established model for them, despite the fact that copyright was never meant to support a business model. It was meant to provide an incentive to produce more art for the benefit of the public. Thank Disney for turning it into a business model protection law.

"Mind you, I'm all for free information, but when free information is putting an innocent developer out of house and home, that's where I draw the line."

Let's just pass laws to protect all jobs that operate under faulty business models or obsolete industries eh? Let's pass a law that protects automobile workers when someone invents teleportation, right? Technology has changed the rules of the game, it always does. If you can't make a living selling non-exclusive, non-rivalrous goods, then you need to earn a living making those goods for those that will pay for it instead. Complaining that people have figured out that the only thing stopping them from making copies is an outdated law, is not anyone's fault but those that relied on a backwards law to base their business non.

Now, here's the part where you assume that I just want everything for free and I'm a non-contributing member of society. Let me disposses you of that illusion. I am not interested in seeing people not get paid for their work, I only wish to see them get paid for what they do rather than what they make. We all pay for labor when we buy products, but the products all represent the same amount of labor applied in the first as the last. So physical products represent a fixed amount of labor. It takes the same amount of labor to produce the first as it does the next. This isn't the case when you look at content. The labor it takes to make the first copy is fixed, but subsequent copies do not require the same amount of labor to reproduce. So, it would stand to reason that the labor that was put into the first copy is the thing we pay for and the additional units are only worth the cost of the medium they are stored on. Given the ease to which one can copy and distribute copies of these works without any effort on the part of its creator, outlines the reality that copies aren't worth anymore than the physical media they are stored on, but the labor that created the first copy is definitely worth paying a fair price for.

As to what kind of model would apply here, I don't know. It hasn't been innovated yet.

-Greevar

"Paste superficially profound, but utterly meaningless quotation here."

-Greevar

"Paste superficially profound, but utterly meaningless quotation here."

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Heh. That was a savage mis-wording on my part. My bad. I musta been sleepy.

However, if you bothered to read the first part, I was simply trying to point out a contradiction, but I probably shoulda guessed that someone would try to nit-pick every little word.

Long story short: Developer Q makes a game. Pirate G decides he wants the game, but doesn't want to pay for it. Pirate G decides to pirate the game. Developer Q makes no money from what is obviously a lost sale. Pirate G gives pirated versions to his buddies, Pirates H, I, and J. Three more lost sales.

What Zippy said basically amounts to Developer Q should be able to make money for their game, but Pirates G, H, I, and J shouldn't have to pay money for the game, either.

But, that's just what I made of it. Feel free to correct me if I misinterpreted that, Zippy.

_____________________________________________________________________________

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

"Livings are made, and fortunes are made and lost in zeroes and ones. If there is no money flow from IP and copyright, how do people get paid?"

Copyright does not generate cash flow, producing content people want does, if there is no demand for what you make, no amount of copyright is going to fix that.

"Mind you, I'm all for free information, but when free information is putting an innocent developer out of house and home, that's where I draw the line."

I seriously doubt people modifying their consoles is going to put anyone out of business. The ones doing so to pirate games probably had no intention of buying in the first place to go through all that effort and risk bricking their console. "We have losses in the billions because of sales that may have occurred in some alternative universe"..give me a break. Though making yourself a pariah and a target for hackers will definitely hurt your business if they shut you down for a month or two....Sony.

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Yeah, those poor buggy whip makers.

Markets change.

 

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Guy wants Other OS back: goes to jail.

Can't imagine what Sony would do to the people who broke into PSN if given the chance. Course, they actually have to catch them first...

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

It's actually fairly unlikely he'll do actual jail time. The court wants to get paid. If he isn't paying because of a lack of resources the court isn't THAT likely to throw him in jail. Jail for contempt is more "You're not paying because you don't want to." He can ask the court for time to pay (at least where I am the courts are really good with that, they'll give you 90 days if you ask for it no questions asked).

I don't know how much his costs are, but they will generally work with you, payment plans and stuff like that. 

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

I guess it would depend on the court.  I admit, I do not know much about the German legal system.

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Very sad situation.

No one should have to loose their freedom simply because their accuser has more resources.

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

I don't see it as losing his freedom for lack of resources. I see it as losing his freedom for doing something he shouldn't have.

_____________________________________________________________________________

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

I think 'shouldn't have' is a bit of a stretch here.   

Even if the law is against him... making it a crime to explain to people how to reactivate a feature they paid for on hardware they own?   That is not something someone 'should' go to jail for.... but Sony has the cash to make it happen.

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

This is going back to the concept of ownership. I personally think it's stupid but that's how it stands. You can own the hardware, but not the software. And unfortunately, you can't re-activate the OtherOS feature without fiddling with the software. And showing people how to modify software they don't own or don't have permission to modify is illegal. You can make a lamp, a nightstand, or a vacuum cleaner out of it. You just can't mess with what makes it do what it's designed to do.

_____________________________________________________________________________

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

They do indeed own their own copy of the software, it is an integral part of the hardware that they purchaced. 

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Not exactly. You don't "Own" the software. It's "licensed" to you. Giving you permission to use it, but not modify it. There is a difference. You own the medium, but not the software. It's in the back of any instruction book of any game, accessory, or hardware you buy.

_____________________________________________________________________________ 

"Power means nothing without honor and pride." 

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site. 

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

You have a severe lack of understanding about copyright and the public domain. Copyright doesn't bar you from modifying software, but it bars you from circumventing the DRM as per the DMCA. I can change the software to enable the Other OS features that were removed and even the remove DRM, so long as I don't share the part that removes the DRM. On the ownership side, Sony doesn't own the software on the PS3. They own the copyright that applies to it. It's in the copyright act. Go read it sometime. The fact that Sony removed Other OS in the first place violates the Sale of Goods Act that requires that a product perfrom as advertised. Taking away Other OS from a PS3 that was advertised to have that feature violates that. Being that is was a niche feature that the majority of PS3 users probably don't use, is immaterial. Had Sony removed that ability of the PS3 to play Blu-Ray discs, I'm sure people would raise a stink and those that fix it would be heroes Yet, this is no different than removing Other OS.

-Greevar

"Paste superficially profound, but utterly meaningless quotation here."

-Greevar

"Paste superficially profound, but utterly meaningless quotation here."

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Why must I repeat myself?

Again, for the last time, OtherOS was never advertised. Not by Sony, at least. There can be no violation of the SGA if there was no advertisement of the OtherOS feature. The only thing you're gonna find is the online User's Guide, but that doesn't legally count as an advertisement.

And, again. It's not really fair to say that OtherOS was "taken away". You only lost it if you accepted the firmware update. The military and the all the scientists who have PS3s running Linux are still working fine, since they never updated the firmware. So it's less "taken away" by Sony and more "given up" by the people who updated. OtherOS is still there on systems without the firmware update and beyond.

_____________________________________________________________________________

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

You own that copy, which you are free to modify and resell.  This is esp true when we are talking about firmware rather then desktop or server software.

Legal attempts to prevent people from doing this have generally failed... usually they only 'succed' in cases like this because the defendent can not afford to go to trial and they give up.

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Again, you're taking the concept of "own" way too liberally. You own the disc or other medium the software is on, but all you bought was a medium and a license to use the software on that medium. Just because you paid for it does not give you free reign to do as you please with it. If you obtain permission from the owner or recieve a free/open source license, such as a GPL, MIT, or BSD license, that's a different story, but most software you buy at retail doesn't carry such a license.

_____________________________________________________________________________

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Heh, all I know is I bought a console to play games on, like it was designed to do. It does that.

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Funny, and that sounds like a perfectly legitimate transaction. Like both sides benefited and there were no horrible human rights violations or censoring involved!

 

It...is...a...videogame console.

-Austin from Oregon

Feel free to check out my blog.

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

You, sir, have won the "Someone FINALLY @#$%ing Gets It" award.

...And a cookie. Cookies are awesome.

_____________________________________________________________________________ 

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

I know people cared about the OtherOS ability, I get it, but it was designed as a game console, and it still does that as well as viewing movies and online play.

Plus I don't get what it can do with Linux that a PC can't.

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

PS3 is AMP, a PC is SMP. It's a gateway to learning how to program systems like that.

 

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Nothing, really. All they're getting is a Linux PC with the power of the PS3. Most see this as the most cost-effective way to getting a high-power Linux PC. I'm sure most have noticed that the PS3's are no longer $400-600 a pop. This is mainly due to the fact that the components to make the PS3 aren't as expensive as they used to be, meaning that if the Linux enthusiasts are as brilliant as they think they are, they could make their own Super-Linux PC at the same price or even cheaper than what they would buy an OtherOS-capable PS3 for.

You can do all the homebrewing you want on a Linux PC just as easily as you can an OtherOS-capable PS3. The way I see it, at this point, the only people griping about the OtherOS being "taken away" are pirates and pirate apologists.

And Anonymous.

_____________________________________________________________________________

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Part of that being that people have used such skills to pirate games.

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

We should lock up chemists.  Their skill can make explosives.

-Ultimately what will do in mankind is a person's fear of their own freedom-

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Well, certain reagents (obviously not all, fertilizer and diesel are available) are regulated because certain people would make explosives. Most of them won't, or will just experiment safely, but it doesn't seem like I'm stifling the creativity of the world of chemists just because we'd arrest them if they started enriching uranium in thair basement.

-Austin from Oregon

Feel free to check out my blog.

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Butbut... There's no such thing as "experiment safely"!!! The point is that they CAN be used to make explosives! These madmen must be STOPPED at any cost! THINK OF THE CHILDREN, DAMN IT!

_____________________________________________________________________________

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

I really do not care what other people have used the feature for. 

If I pay for something, I want it to work as intended.  If the company that made the product later cripples my hardware without my permission, then I have every right to fix it.

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Again, they did nothing to the hardware. The hardware works fine. They just modified the software to lock out OtherOS. Calling it "crippling" is hardly appropriate, since it still does what it was originally designed to do. You ARE aware that OtherOS wasn't there to begin with, right?

_____________________________________________________________________________

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Really?  Because my system can no longer do what it was designed to do.  When I first turned it on there was an Other OS function.  Now there is no Other OS function.  If Sony wants to rob me they can at least be up front about it and shove a gun to my forehead in a dirty alley.

Maybe next they should remove the ability to play games.  Not that it would matter.  I play 90% of my game time on my 360.  At least they haven't dicked me over yet.

-Ultimately what will do in mankind is a person's fear of their own freedom-

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Again, if you read up a little, you'll see that OtherOS wasn't in the original design. It was added after the fact. Just because it was a feature when you bought it doesn't mean that's what it was designed to do. Are people going to whine if they take out trophy support, too? I won't, at least. I never wanted the damn things. It was one of the reasons I bought the PS3 over the Xbox, but I'm not complaining that they put in a feature I never wanted.

_____________________________________________________________________________

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

If you read up a little you'll see that OtherOS was in the design for the system that I purchased.  I'm not really interested if the Model T didn't have a cd player or not.

And are you really comparing a feature being added to a feature being removed?  Really?  Even with trophies being added the system still does what you want it to do.  Not so much for me.

-Ultimately what will do in mankind is a person's fear of their own freedom-

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Firstly, the OtherOS was never "in the design". It's a feature that was added via a firmware update. The PS3 was never designed to install another OS. And yes, I am comparing adding a feature with removing a feature. You're honestly saying they have the right to force a feature onto me, but they don't have a right to take a feature away that was never there in the beginning? That's holding a double standard.

_____________________________________________________________________________

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

if it was never designed to have another OS, why does it have a Hypervisor?

 

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Stealing a page from Andrew Eisen's book here.

"That's not what I said."

I didn't say it was never meant to have another OS, I said that the OtherOS feature wasn't part of the original design, it was added in four months after the system's release via a firmware update.

_____________________________________________________________________________

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

It was never "added" to the console I bought.  It was there from the very moment I turned it on.  Nothing was updated.

And it is in no way making a double standard.  What you are saying is ridiculous and probably borderline trolling.  What you are saying is "Oh, they gave me a coupon to get a free pizza on my next visit.  Now I know how the children of Ethopia feel."

-Ultimately what will do in mankind is a person's fear of their own freedom-

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Firstly, where did you learn that the PS3 was capable of OtherOS, since that seems to be what you bought it for? Certainly not through Sony.

And it's every way holding a double standard. You're quite literally saying that they can force features on to me, the lacking of said features being the reason I bought my PS3 over the Xbox, immediately removing the selling point of the system I bought, but they can't take them away. Your comparison about free pizza makes absolutely no sense. Trolling, indeed.

_____________________________________________________________________________

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

"Firstly, where did you learn that the PS3 was capable of OtherOS, since that seems to be what you bought it for?"

 

Sony's website

"And it's every way holding a double standard. You're quite literally saying that they can force features on to me, the lacking of said features being the reason I bought my PS3 over the Xbox"

Getting more =/= taken away.

By your logic I should report my place of employment for theft since they give me a paycheck,

-Ultimately what will do in mankind is a person's fear of their own freedom-

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

"Sony's website"

I call BS. Sony never actively advertised the OtherOS feature, either with online, television, or magazine ads.

And again, you seem to be dodging my point with nonsensical comparisons. Maybe you didn't understand, so I'll spell it out for you.

Xbox 360 has achievements. I don't like achievements. They're useless and stupid. Playstation 3 did not have achievements/trophies. I liked that, so I used that as a factor in buying my Playstation 3. Now they added trophies, negating one of the reasons I bought the system in the first place. My plight is no different from yours. By your logic, I should be up in arms and hacking my system to remove all trophies, and then spreading my work to all other anti-achievement/trophy gamers of the world.

_____________________________________________________________________________ 

"Power means nothing without honor and pride." 

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site. 

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

"I call BS"

http://manuals.playstation.net/document/en/ps3/current/settings/osinstall.html

"Xbox 360 has achievements. I don't like achievements. They're useless and stupid. Playstation 3 did not have achievements/trophies. I liked that, so I used that as a factor in buying my Playstation 3. Now they added trophies, negating one of the reasons I bought the system in the first place"

But you still have everything you paid for?  Sounds good to me.
 
"My plight is no different from yours. By your logic, I should be up in arms and hacking my system to remove all trophies, and then spreading my work to all other anti-achievement/trophy gamers of the world."
 
First off, don't fucking insult me by saying your plight is no different.  I have less you don't.  More =/= less.  Getting =/= theft.  And my logic said no such thing.  I was saying that it sucks to have things taken from you.  So I can't fault someone for trying to get it back.
 

-Ultimately what will do in mankind is a person's fear of their own freedom-

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

"But you still have everything you paid for?  Sounds good to me."

To put it in terms you can understand. One of the things he paid for was "not having to deal with achievements"; that was a selling point for him. That little pleasure was TAKEN AWAY from him when they added trophies. So no he does not have everything he paid for because one of the hings he paid for was not having to deal with achievments

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Is it me, or is everything an insult to you? I see why you fit perfectly in the Xbox 360 fanbase now.

Just because you're getting something doesn't mean it's good or it adds value. Like I said, I didn't even want trophies, but they were forced on me. OtherOS was not in your system's design.

On the other hand, getting something taken away doesn't necessarily detract from the value. You could have not accepted the firmware update and kept your precious OtherOS feature, same as I could have refused it to not accept trophy support. See? Our plights aren't so different after all, are they?

You bought it for a single UNADVERTISED feature (Way to link a user's guide, instead of an advertisement, by the way, totally not the same. People who don't own a PS3 shouldn't have a reason to go to that site you linked. If you don't own a PS3, you're not a user, are you?) and you accepted the update, and the terms of use to go with it, that removed that one feature you bought it for. Sounds you're the one to blame for your plight, not Sony.

All those PS3s in the military running Linux? Still working, because they aren't updated. Scientists using them for computers? Still working, because they aren't updated.

Your stupid precious feature that you're bitching about wasn't taken away. YOU gave it up. It's still there, anyone with an un-updated PS3 still has it.

And don't "fucking insult" me either by saying I have more and you don't. Let's just assume we have the same firmware: What do I have that you don't? Last I checked, there's nothing mine can do that yours can't. Just because I bought my system for more than a single (Again, UNADVERTISED) feature doesn't mean that I have more than you do. It just means I know how to make the most of what I buy. You have the same features I do. Enjoy them. I know I do.

____________________________________________________________________________

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

Troll eslewhere.

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

"Is it me, or is everything an insult to you? I see why you fit perfectly in the Xbox 360 fanbase now."

 
It's just my reaction to you.  Nothing  personal.  Wait, no, yes it is.  It is exactly that.

 

 

"OtherOS was not in your system's design."

 

Except it was.  From the second I turned the system on.

"On the other hand, getting something taken away doesn't necessarily detract from the value"

Don't be absurd.  Of course it does.  I paid for something, I no longer have it.  Simple as that.  You on the other hand still have everything that you paid for.

"Our plights aren't so different after all, are they?"

Getting =/= Being stolen from.  If you are looking for a kindred spirit, look elsewhere.  Maybe you and Warren Buffet can cry on each other's shoulders about how hard it is to have things.

"You bought it for a single UNADVERTISED feature (Way to link a user's guide, instead of an advertisement,"

I never said it was an advertisement.  But you wanted to know where I found out it can do the OtherOS, so I showed you.  It still doesn't change the fact that I no longer have the product I purchased.

" I know how to make the most of what I buy. You have the same features I do. Enjoy them. I know I do."

Fuck those features.  I hope they fucking remove them.  It will be a cold day in hell before I "enjoy them".

 

-Ultimately what will do in mankind is a person's fear of their own freedom-

Re: PS3 Hacker 'Graf_Chokolo' Sees Jail Time in His Future

"Except it was. From the second I turned the system on."

No. It was not. Just because it's in the system, doesn't mean it's in the design. It was DESIGNED to be a video game machine, not a PC. It was merely capable of being a PC for a time. It actually still is, if you keep the old firmware.

"Don't be absurd. Of course it does. I paid for something, I no longer have it. Simple as that. You on the other hand still have everything that you paid for."

We both paid for the same thing. We simply wanted different things for what we paid for. You still have what you paid for, you just no longer have what you wanted, because you gave it up. Again, it wasn't taken away. All you had to do was keep your old firmware, and you'd still have it.

"I never said it was an advertisement. But you wanted to know where I found out it can do the OtherOS, so I showed you. It still doesn't change the fact that I no longer have the product I purchased."

Which is totally not my original point. I said the OtherOS was never advertised, something anyone has yet to prove me wrong on. What you linked was a User's Guide, something that nobody without a PS3 should be seeing anyway. Why were you looking at a User's Guide if you hadn't bought your PS3 yet?

And again, you bought a PS3, you still have the product you paid for.

All you've displayed is a whiny, entitled, self-important rant on how you've been robbed because you decided to give up the one feature that interested you in your PS3.

"It's just my reaction to you. Nothing personal. Wait, no, yes it is. It is exactly that."

That's nice. Oh, wait. It would be nice if I cared. It's not my fault you take everything that contradicts your beliefs as a personal insult. But if you really want something to take as a personal insult, let me oblige you: You don't deserve to call yourself a gamer. Grow up.

_____________________________________________________________________________

"Power means nothing without honor and pride."

http://grifsgamereviews.blogspot.com My video game review site.

Atlanta Video Games Examiner for examiner.com

 
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Avalongod@Papa, agreed. I think people are reluctant to get involved if they're not the target. But I think we need to take responsibility as a community to confront harassing behavior, whether on gender or race.08/29/2014 - 7:23am
E. Zachary KnightSo Nintendo has given gamers what they want and have fractured the 3DS user base at the same time. http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/224476/Nintendo_reveals_the_New_Nintendo_3DS.php08/29/2014 - 7:12am
Papa MidnightI could say the same about race. I certainly enjoyed being on the receiving end of this while playing StarCraft II this past week: http://i.imgur.com/mIZA1QB.png (and this is actually mild compared to what I usually see). Report players? What a joke...08/29/2014 - 12:29am
AvalongodWhether you approve of Sarkeesian's view or not, no woman deserves to be the target of that kind of harassment and it won't stop until men tell each other it's not appropriate under any circumstance.08/28/2014 - 8:44pm
AvalongodI'm guessing the twitter account was a troll, but come on, I'm sorry, it's just disgusting someone is saying those things to Sarkeesian whether serious or a joke.08/28/2014 - 8:43pm
ZippyDSMleesocial movement that is bringing most of these issue to the spot light to be nothing but trend mongering white knighting bullies who are not much better than the hateful moronic bullies on the other side.08/28/2014 - 5:20pm
ZippyDSMleereflects the world we live in while the rest is the worst stuff that should be focused on. Leaving whats reflected in the same boat as everything else that's exaggerated and skewed by media/fiction and happliy consumed by current society. I find the socia08/28/2014 - 5:20pm
ZippyDSMleemales live off the power fantasy but once you realize as a male you will never reach what fiction or media calls perfect it demoralizes you just the same. And I would not call female negative stereotypes rampant and out of control not when 70-80% of it re08/28/2014 - 5:19pm
ZippyDSMleeNot saying that there is not a difference in the treatment of males and females in media, but males are begin painted as near perfect superhumans with cliched flaws it dose as much damage to the psyche as how females are treated. Sure you could claim that08/28/2014 - 5:19pm
ZippyDSMleeNeeneko:As I said if you do not 100% belive it then you are a Neanderthal. Theres more gray to everything than black and white.08/28/2014 - 1:27pm
NeenekoMeh, the "PCism" is just trotted out when people do not know their place and dare to complain about things the speakers think are fine. How dare people complain about how they are treated/portrayed, it is not like it bother us, our feelings matter!08/28/2014 - 1:13pm
ZippyDSMleeNeeneko I do not think its against feminism but rather against PCisim’s and that most things are offensive since if you do not believe that you are a Neanderthal that beats women,ect..08/28/2014 - 12:48pm
Neenekocomplete with the standard 'she is a lying and attacking the game industry! threats are wrong but she did it to herself' comments.08/28/2014 - 11:28am
Neenekosad, but not surprising. the backlash against feminism has been growing the last few years.08/28/2014 - 11:25am
PHX Corphttp://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/08/27/feminist-video-game-critic-forced-to-leave-her-home-after-online-rape-and-death-threats/ Feminist video game critic forced to leave her home after online rape and death threats08/28/2014 - 9:43am
Uncharted NEShttp://kotaku.com/once-again-atlus-doesnt-want-you-to-spoil-the-new-pers-162782610808/28/2014 - 5:17am
Uncharted NESOnce Again, Atlus Doesn't Want You to Spoil the New Persona08/28/2014 - 5:16am
lomdrPretty much, Andrew. And hell, it helps that it is a bit reasonably priced too. $8 for 1, $12 for both at once08/28/2014 - 3:43am
Andrew EisenMP - Probably not and for good reason. That term holds a lot of deserved negative baggage.08/27/2014 - 10:02pm
Uncharted NESApprently there is still a classic mode, but...08/27/2014 - 9:34pm
 

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