They mention blocking mechanisms to protect children from bad video games. What a coincidence! All of the current generation consoles have parental controls built in. If only parents would take the time to set them, this whole debate over violent games would be over in a flash.

I still say legally enforced ratings are unnecessary because games don’t harm children and nothing in the hundreds of games I’ve played or the dozens of studies I’ve read has led me to believe otherwise.

But I digress.

“Ministers are also expected to advise parents to keep computers and games consoles away from children's bedrooms as much as possible, and ask them to play games in living rooms or kitchens facing outward so carers can see what is being played.”

That’s a great suggestion, one I’ve recommended myself, in fact. If you’re really worried about your children’s media consumption then do not let them have a TV or computer in their room. Put them in a common area where you can see what they’re watching/playing and, dare I say it, get involved in what your children are doing.


Andrew Eisen

@Monkeythumbs:

It's binary thinking. There's America and there's China, and if you're not one then you're the other. A standardised opt-in web filter offered by ISPs for wary parents therefore means severing the undersea tubes and having the internet delivered by morse code after going through military censors. Having the BBFC slap stickers on everything (and issue a temporary ban on one game this decade) rather than just some things means Tetris will be retroactively banned for promoting un-British ideals and GeForces will be recoded to turn blood splatter green.

Parents could be responsible, but why do that when you see an opportunity to cash in on it?

I think it's interesting that they're coming at it from two angles... make it clearer what the content of the games is, and encourage parents to spend more time seeing what their kids are playing.

I don't have any problems with more games going through the BBFC, although I don't really understand why there would need to be, almost every game I have has a BBFC certificate, I can't imagine any game being unsuitable for children but not being required to get a BBFC cert. Unless they're worried about very young children, and games with mild violence.

I wonder what this would mean for Indie game developers in the UK. How much paperwork is involved in obtaining a BBFC certificate? How much does it cost?

I think the US has the right idea: requiring a rating before something can be published would be considered prior restraint, and is therefore unconstitutional.

hmm to be fair tho i do agree with goodrobotus about not really having a problem with games n movies rated n the same legally enforceable way..

at least itl get a load of flack off our backs , and allow us to debate with idiots like cooper lawrence without the age rating issue popping up at least.

Although i do think its a bit mad that they would spend all the money on it... considering in 2005 only 40% of minors could get games underage. I know here in the UK i always got ID'd buying games till i was 18... :S

seems a bit like one of those 'lets get some good press out to look like we are doing something'

Bit like how they ban extasy that causes a few deaths a year (with several million estimated users each week) to look tough on drugs, yet have no problem with alcohol n cigarrettes that cause THOUSANDS of deaths each year.. Just seems like they perhaps have a semi-decent idea but are barking up the wrong tree.

...play games in kitchens facing outwards?!

1) what does that even mean?
2) what parent lets their child play in the kitchen?! Knives, cookers, cleaning fluids etc?

I wonder what this would mean for Indie game developers in the UK. How much paperwork is involved in obtaining a BBFC certificate? How much does it cost?

£300 per submission and "£6.00 per minute for full length of work," which I assume is for the length of the video of game footage. Plus another £35.90 to rate the packaging, then VAT on top of it all.

I think we're buggered lads..

Hang on.. Would this affect children or everyone?

It should be pointed out that Byron herself is probably going to recommend the PEGI system, not the BBFC, I have no idea for the charge for those.

“At present only games showing sex or “gross” violence to humans or animals require age limits [in the U.K.] That leaves up to 90% of games on the market , many of which portray weapons, martial arts and extreme combat, free from statutory labelling.”

Ehhh, I didn't know Sonic the Hedgehog has sex or "gross" violence. It's got a 12+ PEGI, with Madden is 3+. Am I not right saying if it doesn't get a rating, it can't be released by law, and don't PEGI rate all games coming into Europe, the continent that the UK is in, and the BBFC only rate games that have a PEGI rating?

So games get rated one way or another, and they are coming up with they've got to rate all games? I'm thinking this is BS so they can be stricter on games.

@BlackIce,

Exactly, and an over-arching European system such as PEGI would actually be 'fairer' than something like the BBFC which has to conform to social trends to a much more local extent than PEGI. The thing that concerns me is that people will claim that 'Europe isn't England' and that the ratings are too 'liberal'. PEGI themselves would be highly unlikely to refuse to rate a game, regardless of its content, because it is aware that it exists in a multi-cultural environment.

"£300 per submission and “£6.00 per minute for full length of work,” which I assume is for the length of the video of game footage. Plus another £35.90 to rate the packaging, then VAT on top of it all. "
well damn

GoodRobotUs
thank you for pointing that out, its true tho the BBFC censors so the government dose not have to, even if things change in the suggested direction you still will have some thigns baned just because someone up top dose not like it.

So apparently a lot of games don't have to get BBFC ratings to be sold? Didn't realize that. Not that it makes a huge difference in practice, but it's interesting. Does anyone from the UK know if it's the same way with movie ratings?

Right. I think after a bit of reading I understand this. At the moment only 18 cert. games require them to put on the ratings and warnings and restrict them from sale to under 18s.

These new retrictions mean that 15 and 12 cert. games will also have to display their certificate by law rather than voluntarilly and have their ages enforced. The difficulty is that you can't really card for 12/15 and thus have to just take a best guess approach.

@chuma:

You do get 12 and 15 certificate games too and they're treated in the same way as 18s. Student cards are useful over-15 proof of ID. The law states that all boxed games must have a rating in order to be sold, be it BBFC or PEGI etc. Additionally though, the BBFC requires that it rate very adult games. This means that you see plenty of 18 certificates (because the BBFC has to) but very few 15 and lower (because it doesn't really care). Changing the rules to force everything to go past the BBFC means that there'll at least be a consistent set of labels on the boxes.

I'd be happy to see PEGI rate games, the labelling is quite informative for parents; age ratings after all suck, PEGI at least gives you an idea about content. In any case I feel the BBFC will refuse ratings far more regularly than PEGI will. As an added bonus PEGI already rate children's games, so there's no need to worry about "special legislation" of any kind IMO.

Gift.

"Ministers hope the Byron review will act as a way of calming the debate about video games which has become increasingly polarised and based on prejudice."
The Byron report will do nothing to calm this debate, especially when it's finding and proposed legislation based on it is already decided. This report, even before it's actually done, leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

If only the baby-boomers were more techno-literate than techno-phobic, then none of this would be as big an ordeal.

I'd welcome a standardised, legally enforced, pan-European ratings system, although as has been pointed out, controls to restrict content already exist on virtually every modern computer and console out there. Why aren't OS and console manufactures using their PR and marketing budgets to highlight this?

@ Mad_Scientist

The BBFC rates all movies for distribution in the UK, be that for cinemas or for DVDs. That said, if a movie gets shown on the telly, a ratings sign doesn't show up, movies rated 15 or 18 can only be shown after the 9pm scheduling watershed, to the best of my knowledge.

@ ZippyDSMlee : "Politics = fallacy"

Then why do you frequent this site - out of masochism? Either way, BlackIce is right, as per usual.

This reminds me of a movie.... what was it called... ummm, hmmm. I think it started with a V. I know it started with a V. There was a mask involved. Hmmm. Definitely a V.








V For Vendetta....

@GoodRobotUs

Well that's good. If you're right, this changes thing from "scary" to "simply ineffective". One parent cannot find every bad site in the world. Nor can any filter made by professionals, but that's at least more effective. What also makes this funny is that the kids are probably more computer literate than the adults. They'll probably disable it just like I made myself a system administrator at 13 in about an hour of dicking around.

Monkeythumbs
It has to be masochism with my grammar it HAS to be :P

I would be calling BS when the sht flies thats all, some people merely see mud what I see is far stinkier :P

Also some Pan euro countries do enforce age rantings its not standardized because some think its silly protecting the masses from reality.

Altho truthfully if it would kill the bans and let mature media in without censorship or watering down it would be worth it to by pass the poli instigated public blunderbuss.
hell it would give them a reason to slap a tax on mature media to enforce proper sales another way to control it without banning it but it would lead to censorship by proxy....(lowering the rating to bypass the tax) which takes us back to square one.

@ Thomas:

By Panm-European, I meant the PEGI ratings, which tend to be more lenient than BBFC ratings. However, the PEGI ratings process doesn't involve somebody actually playing through the game - unlike the BBFC;s method. So there are plusses and minuses to both systems.

@ Zippy

No, with your grammar it's more like sadism ;)

@ CyberSkull

Where does it say that? I can't see that anywhere.

@Monkeythumbs: I was referring to CyberSkull. (Now there's a phrase you'd never get to type if it weren't for the internet.)

I think it's saddening really that I could say something like that and actually be taken seriously. ;-)

@Monkeythumbs

Zippy's grammar is akin to nothing save slow painful torture and Jack Thompson's voice.

Monkeythumbs /BlackIce, Dragunov Marksman
MA AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
:P

Being ADHD and learning disabled is beyond frustrating at times I need to share the pain :P

@ Marlowe

[APPLAUSE] The movie was utter dross anyway, watered down to the point of irrelevancy. It's not just that the graphic novel is better than the filem, it's that the graphic novel is one of the best pieces of 20th Century literature. Altering it's contents to suit American cinema audeinces was an epic tragedy.

I don't understand, the BFC is a legally enforced rating, and they give all ratings, not just 18, the first resident evil game had a 15 certificate symbol on it. All media like that, both movies, and games, are checked by the BBFC, who are the governing body for certification in the UK.

They wouldn't likely ban a lot of games, the whole Manunt 2 thing was, lets face it, mainly because of the bad press the original game got, plus, you have to realise, if movies like hostel can get by with an 18 rating and not too many cuts, most games will be OK, it's just the likes of manhunt 2 that is in dubious territory. The problem here are multiple though, the BBFC rating is enforceable, but most police wouldn't be particularly bothered, only arresting people where they have to due to pressure.

It's the same in cinemas, I worked in a cinema for 5 years, if we sold tickets to people who were underage we could get fined up to £1000 and be faced with a possible prison sentence, but nobody came to check if we were sticking to it, it's not that the rating system needs to be different, it's the fact that it needs to be enforced, but that can never stop parents from buying games for their kids. As a former cinema worker, I can tell you, parents don't care what their kids see (for the most part) if it gets them out of the way for a few hours, and got really annoyed when I would refuse to let their 14 year old kids into Kill Bill or something they really weren't supposed to see.